Peter of England: He’s still F RE?

[PeanutGallery]

Welcome to the third thread on the rather bizarre and oddly successful guru scammer Peter of England. In the first thread we introduced Peter way back before his scam started to gain ground and before it was promoted by other lamentably influential figures in the Freeman scene. This led Peter to actually being able to sell his dodgy cheque books to a wider audience. He sold them with instructions to his marks, to “not fight it, just pay it”. The second thread was a recap, like this but before a lot of other stuff happened and also stuff that didn't happen (he wasn't arrested and I really thought he would have been).

When the cheques first hit the banks, it led to short term successes for Peter’s customer base, well they ‘worked’ right up until they bounced and everything got reversed. Over on GOODF they were reasonably split down the middle between this is a blatant scam and this is the best thing since sliced bread, in fact the schism led to WeRe bank being given it's own sub forum tucked away in the back, which was eventually locked and left to die. The late BertieBert on GOODF took up the mantle of being the head cheerleader, then he actually died irl, and the role was filled intermittently by Robswift and Chong, although now Quatloos favourite GOODF, JimmyWx11 (James Wyld) a man who claims to have lost his name, in spite of continuing to use most of it as his online identity. Jimmy is still claiming to have had success with the cheques, although he hasn’t explained how or why he is the only person on the planet capable of getting them to work. Even after the Financial Conduct Authority issued a warning against these cheques, which was followed by an article highlighting the scam bank in the Guardian and finally a warning from the Irish Central Bank in Dublin that these cheques were no good.

In true Guru form Peter has attacked those who post about problems, blaming it on the user for not following the woo or in one case for being too young at 25 to have and use a chequebook responsibly. He’s also ignored the pleas for help from customers who are facing some pretty serious hardships, such as one lady who is about to be made homeless in the Chicago area (which is not exactly known for having mild winters), to assist them with their court battles. Instead following a pattern which some have posited fits that of a person suffering from bipolar disorder (manic depression) Peter either posts gibberish or is strangely absent from his own scam.

Undeterred by this Peter moved towards an international audience and soon found some suckers in the USA and Canada, of course over in the colonies the issue of bouncing cheques is taken much more seriously and can lead to a bit of jail time. This doesn’t mean that those using the cheques in the UK are going to be free from blame either, it’s likely that fraud charges may come to some of those who have attempted to purchase things like new cars and kitchens on the back of a phony cheque.

You’d think that a scam like this would be easy for the authorities to bust, I mean Peter’s already lost his bank account, his paypal and has posted multiple videos showing exactly what he looks like on YouTube. But the police and fraud departments have been lamentably slow, although that doesn’t mean he won’t have his collar felt at some point. In fact this lack of any police action, against Peter, has been taken as a sign by some that he is legitimate (even though it’s far more likely that the relevant police departments are making absolutely sure they enough evidence of wrongdoing to get a conviction).

Peter has also now changed his tune, saying that Re Members (those who have signed up for his bank and chequebook) now don’t have to pay any bills because they have the power of refusal and is now instructing his followers to fight it and not pay it, which kind of means that they don’t need the cheque books and in fact seems to be an admission that they never did.

So we can continue the discussion on Peter from here, mostly because the forum software doesn’t seem to like long threads and also because they become somewhat tiresome for a newcomer to read. I’m reasonably sure what I've written gets us up to date, but if anyone thinks I’ve missed something germane to the discussion about PoE then please post it up, I did write most of this from memory.

In the meantime here's a link to Peter's Facebook Page: https://www.facebook.com/Peter-Of-Engla ... 179700768/;
and his YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/ReMovementPolitics;
and the GOODF archive, now locked, on WeRe Bank: http://getoutofdebtfree.org/forum/viewf ... i7fl3rtmko

[Burnaby49]

Good news for Peter of England and the WEre Bank! A wealthy Canadian philanthropist has sent Peter funds to put the bank back on its feet and get a permanent establishment befitting its status as Britain's premier bank. It's all in this video starting at 3'55;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lk85qeCTD2w

Firstly though, before you watch it, a few words about our donor. His name is Allen Boisjoli. An absolute drunk the kool-Aid fully committed true believe Freeman who, when he made this video, was a little over a week away from this massive shitkicking delivered by the Albert Court of Queen's Bench;

viewtopic.php?f=48&t=10814

That may impact on Peter's ability to benefit from Allen's gift because Allen didn't send Peter cash he sent a promissory note for Peter to cash in at a non-WEre bank. Sadly Allen has not had much luck lately trying to cash in his notes himself for personal spending money and, with the recent decision, he can no longer enforce them through the courts. So Peter may have a few problems monetizing Allen's generous donation.

[Burnaby49]

Since this is a new Peter discussion I've locked the previous one.

[The Observer]

Sadly Allen has not had much luck lately trying to cash in his notes himself for personal spending money and, with the recent decision, he can no longer enforce them through the courts. So Peter may have a few problems monetizing Allen's generous donation.

But it's the thought that counts, right?

[pigpot]

Welcome to the third thread on the rather bizarre and oddly successful guru scammer

and NOT CHARGED OR CONVICTED

Peter of England.

[notorial dissent]

Welcome to the third thread on the rather bizarre and oddly successful guru scammer

and NOT CHARGED OR CONVICTED

Peter of England.

YET!!

[rumpelstilzchen]

As far as we know none of PoE's victims, that is the mugs who send him money for worthless cheques, has made an official complaint. They are the only ones who are being fleeced and losing money in this scheme.
You cannot fail to be amused by pigpot's train of thought. He appears to believe that if someone has not been arrested it must mean that individual's actions do not contravene the law.

[Llwellyn]

Okay,

I'd like to start with, first off, Peters Bank.. is by all rules .. totally legal.. BUT it is NOT A LEGAL CURRENCY BANK.
Here in Canada.. you can go to a store, CANADIAN TIRE.. and make purchases.. they will, on your purchases - give you 'money' back.. It is printed on special paper, with special inks and security systems.. IMAGES HERE -https://www.google.ca/search?q=canadian ... Hgod1qQKBA NOW, this 'money' is ONLY usable IN CANADIAN TIRE .. (other places .. depending on the owner, and choices etc will at times give you value of).. This is where PETER is at.. the RE is ONLY usable.. in RE land. (In other words - nowhere -)

Now, his 'legal' system STOPPED the moment he told people to PAY ACTUAL BILLS, with ACTUAL debts, which require ACTUAL currency (or value thereof)

This is in essence a 'white collar' crime.. and with all of the legalities, loopholes, and plethora of possible 'outs' for PETER, I am sure, while the police et al are investigating, nothing will be forthcoming for quite a while.. (If you look at any of the former banking scams, or major white collar schemes .. to process and charge someone was always a long (2-5 years on average) in the making.

In the meantime .. both Here in Canada, and in the United States, passing a cheque (check for the southerners), that is fraudulent, or does not have the ACTUAL/REAL cash value to back it, IS A CRIME. The people using these cheques here, will probably get an initial warning, and if they continue, they will be charged. Most are willing to overlook an 'oopsie' the first time.. after that, they consider it an attempt to commit a form of fraud.

Llwellyn
Guardian and Keeper of the Tor

[Skeleton]

Okay,

I'd like to start with, first off, Peters Bank.. is by all rules .. totally legal.. BUT it is NOT A LEGAL CURRENCY BANK.
Here in Canada.. you can go to a store, CANADIAN TIRE.. and make purchases.. they will, on your purchases - give you 'money' back.. It is printed on special paper, with special inks and security systems.. IMAGES HERE -https://www.google.ca/search?q=canadian ... Hgod1qQKBA NOW, this 'money' is ONLY usable IN CANADIAN TIRE .. (other places .. depending on the owner, and choices etc will at times give you value of).. This is where PETER is at.. the RE is ONLY usable.. in RE land. (In other words - nowhere -)

Now, his 'legal' system STOPPED the moment he told people to PAY ACTUAL BILLS, with ACTUAL debts, which require ACTUAL currency (or value thereof)

This is in essence a 'white collar' crime.. and with all of the legalities, loopholes, and plethora of possible 'outs' for PETER, I am sure, while the police et al are investigating, nothing will be forthcoming for quite a while.. (If you look at any of the former banking scams, or major white collar schemes .. to process and charge someone was always a long (2-5 years on average) in the making.

In the meantime .. both Here in Canada, and in the United States, passing a cheque (check for the southerners), that is fraudulent, or does not have the ACTUAL/REAL cash value to back it, IS A CRIME. The people using these cheques here, will probably get an initial warning, and if they continue, they will be charged. Most are willing to overlook an 'oopsie' the first time.. after that, they consider it an attempt to commit a form of fraud.

Llwellyn
Guardian and Keeper of the Tor

Peter's bank is not legal in the UK. Banks in the UK are required to operate under the regulation of the FSA by way of license. Does not matter what else Peter's bank does or does not do, without that license he is not regulated and therefore is not a legal bank.

[Skeleton]

Okay,

I'd like to start with, first off, Peters Bank.. is by all rules .. totally legal.. BUT it is NOT A LEGAL CURRENCY BANK.
Here in Canada.. you can go to a store, CANADIAN TIRE.. and make purchases.. they will, on your purchases - give you 'money' back.. It is printed on special paper, with special inks and security systems.. IMAGES HERE -https://www.google.ca/search?q=canadian ... Hgod1qQKBA NOW, this 'money' is ONLY usable IN CANADIAN TIRE .. (other places .. depending on the owner, and choices etc will at times give you value of).. This is where PETER is at.. the RE is ONLY usable.. in RE land. (In other words - nowhere -)

Now, his 'legal' system STOPPED the moment he told people to PAY ACTUAL BILLS, with ACTUAL debts, which require ACTUAL currency (or value thereof)

This is in essence a 'white collar' crime.. and with all of the legalities, loopholes, and plethora of possible 'outs' for PETER, I am sure, while the police et al are investigating, nothing will be forthcoming for quite a while.. (If you look at any of the former banking scams, or major white collar schemes .. to process and charge someone was always a long (2-5 years on average) in the making.

In the meantime .. both Here in Canada, and in the United States, passing a cheque (check for the southerners), that is fraudulent, or does not have the ACTUAL/REAL cash value to back it, IS A CRIME. The people using these cheques here, will probably get an initial warning, and if they continue, they will be charged. Most are willing to overlook an 'oopsie' the first time.. after that, they consider it an attempt to commit a form of fraud.

Llwellyn
Guardian and Keeper of the Tor

Welcome

Peter's bank is not legal in the UK. Banks in the UK are required to operate under the regulation of the FSA by way of license. Does not matter what else Peter's bank does or does not do, without that license he is not regulated and therefore is not a legal bank.

[PeanutGallery]

Welcome to the third thread on the rather bizarre and oddly successful guru scammer

and NOT CHARGED OR CONVICTED

Peter of England.

I see reading is hard for you because I devoted one specific paragraph to the whole "He's not been arrested bit". Maybe you missed it, to help I've stuck it here:

You’d think that a scam like this would be easy for the authorities to bust, I mean Peter’s already lost his bank account, his paypal and has posted multiple videos showing exactly what he looks like on YouTube. But the police and fraud departments have been lamentably slow, although that doesn’t mean he won’t have his collar felt at some point. In fact this lack of any police action, against Peter, has been taken as a sign by some that he is legitimate (even though it’s far more likely that the relevant police departments are making absolutely sure they enough evidence of wrongdoing to get a conviction).

I don't really see what your point is, except to show that you jumped head first into the shallow gene pool of those who think that simply because he hasn't been arrested yet, even though a number of authorities have issued warnings that are intended to warn consumers that this is a scam, what he is doing must be legitimate. Stealing is still stealing regardless of whether you get caught or not and being caught doesn't make it wrong.

Personally I'm very glad that Quatloos was reporting on this guy long before the authorities became aware of him, I feel that we may have been a resource they used to identify the nature of his scam and also am aware that the information we posted up helped to prevent people from wasting money on cheque books and risking a whole raft of trouble associated with sending someone a fake cheque.

[#six]

Welcome to the third thread on the rather bizarre and oddly successful guru scammer

and NOT CHARGED OR CONVICTED

Peter of England.

I see reading is hard for you because I devoted one specific paragraph to the whole "He's not been arrested bit". Maybe you missed it, to help I've stuck it here:

You’d think that a scam like this would be easy for the authorities to bust, I mean Peter’s already lost his bank account, his paypal and has posted multiple videos showing exactly what he looks like on YouTube. But the police and fraud departments have been lamentably slow, although that doesn’t mean he won’t have his collar felt at some point. In fact this lack of any police action, against Peter, has been taken as a sign by some that he is legitimate (even though it’s far more likely that the relevant police departments are making absolutely sure they enough evidence of wrongdoing to get a conviction).

I don't really see what your point is, except to show that you jumped head first into the shallow gene pool of those who think that simply because he hasn't been arrested yet, even though a number of authorities have issued warnings that are intended to warn consumers that this is a scam, what he is doing must be legitimate. Stealing is still stealing regardless of whether you get caught or not and being caught doesn't make it wrong.

Personally I'm very glad that Quatloos was reporting on this guy long before the authorities became aware of him, I feel that we may have been a resource they used to identify the nature of his scam and also am aware that the information we posted up helped to prevent people from wasting money on cheque books and risking a whole raft of trouble associated with sending someone a fake cheque.

Exactly. Bernie Madoff wasn't arrested for quite some time but that didn't mean his activities were legal.

[NYGman]

Welcome to the third thread on the rather bizarre and oddly successful guru scammer

and NOT CHARGED OR CONVICTED

Peter of England.

Charged, why yes he has. All that Positive Energy flowing from Peter and WeRe Bank, has certainly got Peter Charged up. As for Convicted, he is certainly convicted in his belief that WeRe Bank is real. Unfortunately, neither his positive charge or his convictions will keep him safe. His time is limited, his concepts flawed, and his grasp of reality is fleeting at most. As I said before, Peter is no longer free, he is chained to his ideals, which will end up being his downfall.

[Hyrion]

being caught doesn't make it wrong

To help clarify the point:

• Bad behavior is still bad even if you have not been disciplined for it yet.

[Hyrion]

I'd like to start with, first off, Peters Bank.. is by all rules .. totally legal..

Is it? By all rules?

Source: http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts ... lText.html

362. (1) Every one commits an offence who

(c) knowingly makes or causes to be made, directly or indirectly, a false statement in writing with intent that it should be relied on, with respect to the financial condition or means or ability to pay of himself or herself or any person or organization that he or she is interested in or that he or she acts for, for the purpose of procuring, in any form whatever, whether for his or her benefit or the benefit of that person or organization,

• (ii) the payment of money,
  (iii) the making of a loan,
  (iv) the grant or extension of credit,
  (vi) the making, accepting, discounting or endorsing of a bill of exchange, cheque, draft or promissory note; or

(d) knowing that a false statement in writing has been made with respect to the financial condition or means or ability to pay of himself or herself or another person or organization that he or she is interested in or that he or she acts for, procures on the faith of that statement, whether for his or her benefit or for the benefit of that person or organization, anything mentioned in subparagraphs (c)(i) to (vi).

(3) Every one who commits an offence under paragraph (1)(b), (c) or (d) is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding ten years.

I personally think it can be reasonably argued that PoE/PoE's Bank has made false representations as to the nature and financial validity of WeRe Bank Cheques and he has indeed financially charged for the "product".

So it seems to me Peter's Bank falls afoul of this particular rule although one would have to examine in much greater detail the surrounding case Law on this point relative to PoE's situation.

As you believe the Bank is legit "by all rules", you must have examined the situation in detail. So perhaps you can explain how PoE's Bank does not fall in breach of the Criminal Law identified above.

[Llwellyn]

I started with the 'First Off' .. for the reason that under Peters original terms, his 'bank' was totally legal (in so much as/similar to Canadian Tire - which prints its own money -usable really only in their own stores - ).. and that I qualified that his idea became .. illicit as soon as he started telling people to pay actual debts with his fictitious 'bank', and his fictitious 'currency'..

The whole base of the Re Bank (or in that case, any system like the Re, or Bitcoin etc) is that in its foundation, and the original terms that were stated.. (you buy in Re, you get paid in Re etc) are indeed correct and legal..
That fell.. once people were told to pay actual debts with imaginary/unacceptable/fraudulent currency.

Now in the example of say, BITCOIN, it has in general, become an acceptable pay/currency. However, no one is bound to accept BITCOIN payment.. Bitcoin its self is generally recognized as having a tangible asset/value, but that does not make it a 'legal' currency. If I tell you that I am going to pay you (for whatever), in Bitcoins.. you do not have to accept it. Where as with legal tender, (of the realm), you do (unless terms and conditions apply).

What eludes most of the sovrun/freeman/I-Want-Everything-Without-Actually-Paying-For-it groups, is what defines 'legal' currency. Most countries have their own currency, that is backed by the countries government... that is to say, in Canada, the Canadian dollar is backed by the government as having X# value IN CANADA.. that dollar has (in theory) asset value or a tangible backing.
The Re has.. a bunch of promises, with no shown actual tangible backing.

Llwellyn
Guardian and Keeper of the Tor

[littleFred]

... Canadian Tire - which prints its own money -usable really only in their own stores ...

As you probably know, Peter's Re isn't usable by anyone at all. Not even by Peter. He invented a currency that he insists everyone except himself has to accept.

Of course, in itself, that isn't illegal. I have also invented my own currency (Fred Units) and offer to sell them to anyone who will give me legal currency in return. Hardly surprisingly, no-one has taken me up on the offer. That's because I don't surround my invented FU currency with lies about how you can pay bills with it.

Peter can soon celebrate 1000 members on the private WeRe forum. But I don't think he will be celebrating. The few posts over the last few days are along the lines of:

I have been on research mode this weekend. Here is what I know and feel at the moment - we are being conned. Non of us are able to get our WeRe Bank checks cleared through US banks or US creditors no matter what. Nor are we receiving any help from Peter or his staff. Except for the condescending, non forthright, and contraindicating responses on tickets submitted (if they are responded to at all).

People wake up yes this is a good concept, however the ONLY person benefiting from the WeRe Re-Movement is Peter and his administration. We are sending him gold, silver and cash. He has made millions off of us ALL. NOT once have I seen him post that the fight would be this big or that we would probably not win. Look at everything some have lost and posted about. He post false videos from banks accepting and cash checks. He has made up this SWALLOW system that is not accepted (banks and creditors).

I asked for direction instead I have been told at "25 years old I do not deserve a checkbook and not to moan", I am not a stupid man. Peter you do not know me! I am sending a letter from one of creditors who signed with a name and phone number to Peter's legal team. Lets see what they tell me now. ALL of my credit cards have been CLOSED since I have submitted these WeRe Bank checks - WONDERFUL!

My suggestion to Peter is to monetize promissory notes we all have with him so that we can truly pay our debt off and to use SWIFT.

Sorry for your predicament MH. You are right WeRe Bank is a good concept but Peter's implimentation is flawed. Unless it is brought to head with a court case between a WeRe Bank cheque drawer and a payee or bank then it's just an academic exercise going nowhere. I can forsee WeRe Bank members leaving in droves if there is no change.

So Peter's now telling people to REFUSE to pay?

And exactly how does Peter think that stamping a document with a Re-Movement logo is going to help anyone? Quite frankly, this 'Inviolable Human Sovereignty' sounds crackpot and another fantasy, along with 'debt eradication', 'legal support from Freeman Legal Services', 'gold-backed currency', 'free insurance' and all the other things members were promised and which haven't materialised.

I have taken the decision to opt out of further were actions from today.

You don't need to be a a rocket scientist to know that many many WeRe Bank members are totally dissatisfied with the support they are NOT receiving from Peter!!

Members are being summonsed to court and are been "eaten alive" by the Judiciary.

Now we have have members openly posting that they have had enough of the way their please of help are going ignored and are now choosing to LEAVE THE WeRe BANK MOVEMENT!!!!!!

So I would like to openly invite Peter to inform the members just what he is going to do to HELP them against the banks and corporations refusing to except/process the WeRe Bank cheques????????

We were informed of the Freeman Legal Services; however this has been proved to be a complete SHAM ............

so come on Peter, why don't you be a man and address the members concerns?????????

[NYGman]

Linda the Slut finally came to her senses, about WeRe checks that is, I am guessing she will hold on to her Sovereign beliefs. Never Trust a Fake banker

[noblepa]

I started with the 'First Off' .. for the reason that under Peters original terms, his 'bank' was totally legal (in so much as/similar to Canadian Tire - which prints its own money -usable really only in their own stores - ).. and that I qualified that his idea became .. illicit as soon as he started telling people to pay actual debts with his fictitious 'bank', and his fictitious 'currency'..

The whole base of the Re Bank (or in that case, any system like the Re, or Bitcoin etc) is that in its foundation, and the original terms that were stated.. (you buy in Re, you get paid in Re etc) are indeed correct and legal..
That fell.. once people were told to pay actual debts with imaginary/unacceptable/fraudulent currency.

Now in the example of say, BITCOIN, it has in general, become an acceptable pay/currency. However, no one is bound to accept BITCOIN payment.. Bitcoin its self is generally recognized as having a tangible asset/value, but that does not make it a 'legal' currency. If I tell you that I am going to pay you (for whatever), in Bitcoins.. you do not have to accept it. Where as with legal tender, (of the realm), you do (unless terms and conditions apply).

What eludes most of the sovrun/freeman/I-Want-Everything-Without-Actually-Paying-For-it groups, is what defines 'legal' currency. Most countries have their own currency, that is backed by the countries government... that is to say, in Canada, the Canadian dollar is backed by the government as having X# value IN CANADA.. that dollar has (in theory) asset value or a tangible backing.
The Re has.. a bunch of promises, with no shown actual tangible backing.

Llwellyn
Guardian and Keeper of the Tor

Are you saying that Peter started off with a legal enterprise, but crossed the line into illegality later?

If so, I think I disagree. As far as I remember, Peter was claiming from the beginning that his WeRe cheques MUST be accepted. At first, he only claimed that they were valid for "Public debt", whatever he meant by that. But, IIRC, he always insisted that the recipient was legally bound to accept a WeRe cheque, even as he simultaneously said he would never pay out in British pounds, only in his fictitious "Re" units.

There are several big differences between Re units and Bitcoin. First, bitcoin is voluntary. No one makes the claim that anyone MUST accept bitcoins or the debt is forgiven. Secondly, if I buy bitcoins, I can later redeem them for real, honest-to-goodness US dollars (or other real currencies, I presume). Peter has always said that he will accept pounds but will not pay pounds.

So, I think that he has engaged in fraud from the very beginning, by accepting real money (pounds sterling) in exchange for worthless WeRe units and cheques, with no possibility of ever redeeming those Re units for real currency. It was never a case of "you buy in Re, you get paid in Re". You buy in pounds or dollars (US or Canadian), you get paid in Re. He further made the (IMHO) fraudulent claims that the cheques could be used to pay other, nonparticipants, debts that were incurred in real currency.

IANAL, so I can't offer an opinion as to whether he is legally guilty of fraud against the recipients of the bogus WeRe cheques (credit card companies, public utilities, local councils), or only against the WeRe bank members who purchased and attempted to use the WeRe cheques. I believe that, in the US, he would be guilty of conspiracy to commit fraud, but I may have been watching too many episodes of "Law and Order".

[PeanutGallery]

Lots of words about how Peter sucks

What I find interesting about the passage above is that it would seem that Peter's own postings are waking his customers up to the fact he's scamming them and that Peter is doing a better job at pulling the wool from their eyes than we have been able so far.

His most recent ramble which was to refuse to pay was I think an especially stupid gambit for someone whose entire scam is built around convincing the suckers you have a magical means by which they can pay for their debts. Peter has quite easily talked his suckers away from his own scam by stupidly changing the sales pitch half way through.

Well done Peter.