Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

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longdog
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by longdog »

rumpelstilzchen wrote:
aesmith wrote:So looks like mortgage arrears in addition to the debts leading up to bankruptcy. Failing or failed BTL "empire".
Previously in this thread I questioned why someone who owned ten rental properties would waste their valuable time on a deadbeat group like the PLDers. Now that it has been confirmed that Crabby is in arrears with at least five mortgage accounts, I think my question has been answered.
I suppose it's conceivable that the mortgages are in arrears because the bankruptcy is stopping the rental income reaching the mortgage accounts due to the OR/trustee taking control of the account into which the rents are being paid.

Or maybe it's like you say and he was already in the shit and this LR crap is his attempt to get free houses.
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SANDY: That's your actual Latin.
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JULIAN: I dunno - I got it off a bottle of horse rub, but it sounds good, doesn't it?
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by SteveUK »

I strongly suspect you’re correct . Most of the PLD stats seem to have arrived there after getting in the shit and googling ‘how to avoid debt’.

I doubt a single member gives a hoot about the constitution.
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by aesmith »

longdog wrote:
rumpelstilzchen wrote:I suppose it's conceivable that the mortgages are in arrears because the bankruptcy is stopping the rental income reaching the mortgage accounts due to the OR/trustee taking control of the account into which the rents are being paid.
I don't think that should happen, as I'm sure the trustee would have a duty towards all the creditors and also to the bankrupt himself, a duty to settle the debts as efficiently as possible. On the other hand if Crabbie's not provided details of his affairs, then there could be exactly that sort of collateral damage. Any bankruptcy experts here? I was also wondering if undeclared or concealed debts get written off on discharge from bankruptcy. He seems to think he's being clever by concealing his bankruptcy from the council tax people, so I was wondering if this means that particular debt will still be pursued even if/when he gets discharged.
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by ArthurWankspittle »

I think any creditor has to tell the OR they are owed something. I also think Council Tax will have its own rules and I would be surprised if you can get out of it by bankruptcy.
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by KickahaOta »

aesmith wrote:I don't think that should happen, as I'm sure the trustee would have a duty towards all the creditors and also to the bankrupt himself, a duty to settle the debts as efficiently as possible.
I certainly don't claim to be a legal expert, let alone on UK bankruptcy law. There are all sorts of legal standards applied to different people in different contexts. But a requirement to do anything 'as well as possible' -- or, in this case, 'as efficiently as possible' -- is extremely rare. People are required to do things reasonably, diligently, prudently, responsibly -- pretty much any adverb you can imagine -- but not perfectly.

In the bankruptcy context, it would be particularly unwise to impose a standard of 'as well as possible'. Bankruptcies are inherently thorny things, with the debtors losing their assets, and the creditors often losing part or all of their claims. There are very few happy people in bankruptcy court. Nobody would want to administer a bankruptcy estate if any of those many unhappy people could hold the OP/trustee/insert-administrator-here responsible for a slight misstep.

And, of course, in the bankruptcy context, you also have to consider that the debtor's finances will inherently not be in the best of shape already, because, well, they're bankrupt. My car has some modest self-driving features, and many people ask: 'How can you trust it? Computers make mistakes!' And my answer is always the same: 'It doesn't have to be perfect. It just has to be slightly better than me.' If my finances (or my debtor's finances) have already gone into the metaphorical ditch along the financial highway, and the metaphorical traffic of commerce is snarling up, then the metaphorical tow truck of bankruptcy needs to do its job; and I'm in a poor position to complain if there's an extra scratch in the metaphorical paint afterwards.
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by longdog »

To be honest I've always assumed that Bobby's 'rebellion' and his being bankrupted for forty grand's worth of unpaid business rates were a case of "Won't pay" rather than "Can't pay". It never really occurred to me that he might actually be in debt up to his eyebrows and defaulting on multiple BTL mortgages because he's just a really shit businessman.

How his prison spell for nearly killing a biker through drink driving factors into this is another unknown factor but I can't think it will have helped much.
JULIAN: I recommend we try Per verulium ad camphorum actus injuria linctus est.
SANDY: That's your actual Latin.
HORNE: What does it mean?
JULIAN: I dunno - I got it off a bottle of horse rub, but it sounds good, doesn't it?
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by SteveUK »

The creditors are all ranked in terms of payout. At the top is the tax man , then secured creditors , then the rest of the people.

Crabbies wipe out will be consumed in that order , I doubt much will be left for the tenants.
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by hucknallred »

longdog wrote: How his prison spell for nearly killing a biker through drink driving factors into this is another unknown factor but I can't think it will have helped much.
http://www.kentonline.co.uk/sheerness/n ... ror-44094/
White will have to take an extended test before he can drive again. Judge Carey said White had a business which he ran from home.

His wife, who suffers from arthritis, feared the business would collapse if he were sent to prison.
He went down in Oct '15, probably released after 6 to 8 months if he behaved, maybe things started going south during his stretch.
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by Hercule Parrot »

rumpelstilzchen wrote:Previously in this thread I questioned why someone who owned ten rental properties would waste their valuable time on a deadbeat group like the PLDers. Now that it has been confirmed that Crabby is in arrears with at least five mortgage accounts, I think my question has been answered.
Indeed. I suspect "Kaptain Krabby's Precariously Leveraged Property Empire" is going down with all hands...

Image
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by The Seventh String »

ArthurWankspittle wrote:I think any creditor has to tell the OR they are owed something. I also think Council Tax will have its own rules and I would be surprised if you can get out of it by bankruptcy.
If the council has a liability order for council tax arrears before the date of bankruptcy it can still send the bailiffs in, but it can’t use any other method such as attachment of earnings or benefits to recover the arrrears.

Being bankrupt doesn’t excuse you from ongoing council tax payments of course.
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by The Seventh String »

longdog wrote:I suppose it's conceivable that the mortgages are in arrears because the bankruptcy is stopping the rental income reaching the mortgage accounts due to the OR/trustee taking control of the account into which the rents are being paid.

Or maybe it's like you say and he was already in the shit and this LR crap is his attempt to get free houses.
It’s possible that the mortgage agreements have provision for the entire debt falling immediately due if the borrower becomes bankrupt at any time, even if the mortgages were previously being paid as per the agreement and weren’t in arrears.

As I understand things, secured debts aren’t included in the bankruptcy debts and can still be pursued by the lender. So the bank can carry on with its debt recovery measures regardless. Presumably it’s open to the bank to agree a fresh repayment schedule should they wish to.

As far as the bankrupt’s mortgage on their home is concerned the property would usually be sold and the various creditors starting with secured lender(s) get what comes from the sale. If the sale doesn’t realise enough to cover the secured debts the bankrupt is usually released from any outstanding amounts on discharge from bankruptcy because any residual debt is no longer secured.

But the landlord properties aren’t the bankrupt’s own home but business assets and the business will now be under the management of the receiver. Quite how that works out I’m not sure.

I guess one lesson from this is that if you’re going to run businesses that might acumulate significant debt then form a limited liability partnership/company whenever possible. Anyone can run into unanticipated financial difficulties, all it takes is an accident or illness, so don’t think it can never happen to you.

Another lesson is not to mess about with the receiver or your creditors if the worst happens. All it does is worsen your own position.
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by AndyPandy »

From looking at the letter from NatWest I'm left with the impression the arrears aren't just over the last couple of months. Might be wrong but I think he's been getting deeper in the sh;t for quite a while and it's all coming tumbling down around him.
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by SteveUK »

and its going to get a lot worse. Us landlords can use the interest on the mortgage as a business expense when doing the taxes, thus lowering your liability. That's all about to change, and for landlords in it for the long run (ie, full mortgage term then cash in, barely break even on a monthly basis) they're about to be tipped into monthly losses.
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by Wakeman52 »

Mr White on PLD FB recently...
So mid Kent enforcement services have now handed my council tax case over to rundles for collection, I’ve never dealt with them before so it should be interesting to see if they have more balls than equita. This time last year equita were after £11k threatening a xmas visit, done the process with them and never had one visit ho, ho ho, and obviously I didn’t pay. So many people are scared of the bailiffs, but if you deal with them the A61 way you can have so much fun.
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by longdog »

So many people are scared of the bailiffs, but if you deal with them the A61 way you can have so much fun.
Because it worked so well with Southampton Council, Medway magistrates and the official receiver :snicker:
JULIAN: I recommend we try Per verulium ad camphorum actus injuria linctus est.
SANDY: That's your actual Latin.
HORNE: What does it mean?
JULIAN: I dunno - I got it off a bottle of horse rub, but it sounds good, doesn't it?
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by Hercule Parrot »

I wonder what the fragrant Irene thinks about all of this. Krabby may be ready to dwell in a cardboard box to prove his unflinching principles, but I can't imagine that she is keen on that.
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by SteveUK »

Great news for Crabbie!!!!1!!! The http://www.commonlawcourt.com finally got around to hearing his case against the LR a few days ago. And you won't adam & eve it - he won!
ROBERT WHITE v THE LAND REGISTRY, ENGLAND
COMMON LAW COURT
LEITH BUSINESS CENTRE, 4A MARINE ESPLANADE, EDINBURGH EH6 7LU
19th NOVEMBER 2017


As a result of unlawful behaviour against him and to assert his rights under Common Law, Robert White has used the Common Law Court and paperwork to support his claim for a lawful remedy.

The issues being addressed are lawful wrongs committed against him and the theft of his property.

As part of this dispute, Robert White has obtained Lis Pendens for his properties, these deeds have been recorded in the 'Book of Deeds' but also need to be recorded for preservation with the Land Registry in England, to assist with his lawful remedy.

The Land Registry in England are refusing to accept the above deeds for preservation.

To assist with his claim, Robert White wishes to highlight the following:

The Land Registry have failed to provide a copy of their policy for accepting deeds for preservation.

The Land Registry have failed to produce a copy of their public interest policy.

The Land Registry have failed to confirm what authority, legal or otherwise that allows them to refuse to accept these deeds.
The judgement has been published here :https://docs.wixstatic.com/ugd/fadada_6 ... 16bfda.pdf

Case files: https://www.commonlawcourt.com/robertwhite

Thank god for that, he and the missus can finally breathe a sigh of relief.
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by aesmith »

SteveUK wrote:The judgement has been published here :https://docs.wixstatic.com/ugd/fadada_6 ... 16bfda.pdf
No wet ink signature, no proper seal. Is there even any evidence the fee was paid? Looks void to me, probably treasonous as well.
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by SteveUK »

aesmith wrote:
SteveUK wrote:The judgement has been published here :https://docs.wixstatic.com/ugd/fadada_6 ... 16bfda.pdf
No wet ink signature, no proper seal. Is there even any evidence the fee was paid? Looks void to me, probably treasonous as well.
You're right, how could i have missed that! I would say get Guy or Ebert on the case, but as they're out of the scene, it'll have to fall to Tom.
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Re: Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

Post by longdog »

Unfortunately a higher, actually the highest common law court has just voided all of those judgements :snicker:

https://iclsc.blogspot.co.uk/2017/11/in ... e-and.html
JULIAN: I recommend we try Per verulium ad camphorum actus injuria linctus est.
SANDY: That's your actual Latin.
HORNE: What does it mean?
JULIAN: I dunno - I got it off a bottle of horse rub, but it sounds good, doesn't it?