CtC's Weston White: Fake quotes & other problems

[Famspear]

Just remember, you wouldn't be here right not under a U.S. flag defending payment of taxes to the U.S. government if it were not for a bunch of "tax cheats" and people who refused to accept the rule of law.

No, the Founding Fathers were not "tax cheats" -- not as we use the term today to apply to tax protesters. The Founding Fathers did what they did HONESTLY. And when the Founding Fathers rejected the rule of law of Britain, they did so honestly -- by a real revolution. Not by lies and distortions and delusions.

[SteveSy]

Just remember, you wouldn't be here right not under a U.S. flag defending payment of taxes to the U.S. government if it were not for a bunch of "tax cheats" and people who refused to accept the rule of law.

No, the Founding Fathers were not "tax cheats" -- not as we use the term today to apply to tax protesters. The Founding Fathers did what they did HONESTLY. And when the Founding Fathers rejected the rule of law of Britain, they did so honestly -- by a real revolution. Not by lies and distortions and delusions.

Whatever! Man you really need to learn the history of the revolution. Do you think the people who dumped all the tea in Boston harbor admitted they did so? Do you think all of the smugglers who were illegally importing and those who purchased it admitted they did so to the the British authorities when they came a knocking? Where they honest when they tared, feathered and burned the houses of the tax collectors? The colonies where rife with illegal acts and dishonesty under the British law prior to the revolution. The revolution happened when Britain got pissed enough to start sending troops to stop it.

That quote I offered the background to deals with dishonesty. Franklin was marveling at the fact that people had the nonchalant attitude that property was worth more because it allowed for easy smuggling.

But there is no kind of dishonesty into which otherwise good people more easily and frequently fall, than that of defrauding government of its revenues, by smuggling when they have an opportunity, or encouraging smugglers by buying their goods.

I fell into these reflections the other day, on hearing two gentlemen of reputation discoursing about a small estate, which one of them was inclined to sell, and the other to buy; when the seller, in recommending the place, remarked, that its situation was very advantageous on this account, that being on the seacoast, in a smuggling country, one had frequent opportunities of buying many of the expensive articles used in a family, such as tea, coffee, chocolate, brandy, wines, cambricks, Brussels laces, French silks, and all kinds of India goods, 20, 30, and in some articles 50 per cent cheaper than they could be had in the more interior parts, of traders that paid duty. The other honest Gentleman allowed this to be an advantage, but insisted that the seller, in the advanced price he demanded on that account, rated the advantage much above its value. And neither of them seemed to think dealing with Smugglers a practice that an honest man (provided he got his goods cheaper) had the least reason to be ashamed of.

- 1767

[Famspear]

Whatever! Man you really need to learn the history of the revolution.

Whatever? No, not whatever.

And no, I don't need to "learn the history of the revolution." I was probably studying the history of the Revolution before you were born.

Do you think the people who dumped all the tea in Boston harbor admitted they did so?

So, in terms of honesty, you put the participants in the Tea Party in the same category as people who make stupid, legally frivolous arguments about the nature of federal income taxes?

Do you think all of the smugglers who were illegally importing and those who purchased it admitted they did so to the the British authorities when they came a knocking?

So, are you equating that kind of dishonesty with the dishonesty of filing false tax returns?

[Judge Roy Bean]

....There is no kind of dishonesty into which otherwise good people more easily and frequently fall than that of defrauding the government.

Kind of ironic really....That quote came from a paper printed in London just prior to all out war against Britain, November 1767. It was concerning smuggling goods into this country while avoiding the taxes we were so pissed about paying. Using that quote in support of a government would be kinda like saying we should still be under British rule. He also says the following quotes in the same article.
"Our proverb too says truly, that the receiver is as bad as the thief" and see a "mote in their brother’s eye, while they do not discern a beam in their own" in reference to those who are objecting to the people avoiding taxation.

I think you're missing the point, Steve. Franklin was to say the least a keen observer of human nature and the fact is, a lot of otherwise honest people see "government" as the easiest entity to defraud without any remorse.

In some cases, they develop complex rationalizations. Some of them aren't really very good at it and when the facade begins to crumble they try even harder. Then comes the point where they haven't learned that to get out of the hole you've dug the first order of business is to stop digging.

[Joey Smith]

Thread closed due to subject hijacking.

[Imalawman]

Thread closed due to subject hijacking.

Mea Culpa.