Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

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Quixote
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Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by Quixote »

Are the Lostheads even reading posts before they praise them? Several of them, including richardf614 and Subvet, praised a letter containing the following interesting bits.
If you are familiar with the Wilson Gorman Tariff Act, of 1894 and the United States supreme Court decision on the capitation tax it contained, then you understand that it was stopped with the Courts decision. The Court determined that it was "unconstitutional" and would lead to a "Communist threat to property."
I cannot find a Bill that allows a capitation tax to be levied on me. Show me the Law that I can challenge before the Supreme Court so that I can get it overturned once again.
In case you have forgotten.
Article I section 7: "All Bills for raising Revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives. .."

This means that there has to be a Bill passed by the House to collect money from any source. It says "Bill," not Act:
Article I section 9 (this spells out just what the Congress is prohibited from doing)
"No capitation, or other direct, Tax shall be laid..."
The Sixteenth Amendment “Created no new Power of taxation” and it “Did not change the Constitutional limitation, which forbids any direct taxation of individuals.” - Brushaber V. Union Pacific Rail Road Co., 240 U.S. 1
"Here is a fundamental question to ask yourself- what is the goal of the income tax scam? I think it is a means to extract wealth from the masses and give it to a parasite class." Skankbeat
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by Pottapaug1938 »

So what else is new? There must be some intrinsic characteristic of LoserHeads which makes them unable to correctly determine the holding in a Supreme Court case, or else make a quotation in context.

They also cannot comprehend how the legislative process works -- they have no understanding of how a bill becomes an Act, or law.
"We've been attacked by the intelligent, educated segment of the culture." -- Pastor Ray Mummert, Dover, PA, during an attempt to introduce creationism -- er, "intelligent design", into the Dover Public Schools
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by fortinbras »

lost horizons wrote: The Sixteenth Amendment “Created no new Power of taxation” and it “Did not change the Constitutional limitation, which forbids any direct taxation of individuals.” - Brushaber V. Union Pacific Rail Road Co., 240 U.S. 1
The second quotation is a fake and not found in the court's decision.
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wserra
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by wserra »

fortinbras wrote:The second quotation is a fake and not found in the court's decision.
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Famspear
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by Famspear »

Yesterday, June 19, Patrick Michael Mooney responded to Rusty Ragan's initial steps at emerging from the delusional thinking from which Patrick and other scammers suffer:
This is coward's talk, Rusty.

I appreciate you taking the fight to Tax Court. I lost there as well. But in losing, I saw clearly that Pete is entirely CORRECT on the fundamental issues of law. I know you see that, too.

[ . . . . ]
:roll:

Patrick continues:
But can't you see that this issue goes way beyond a Court's capacity to judge the law?

WE ARE THE LAW! The government is supposed to serve us, via the laws we have proscribed for ourselves.

To say that this process can not be honored because LAWYERS have perverted the system with crooked case law is preposterous.

Eventually, and most likely soon, this process is going to spill out into the streets.

[ . . . . ]

I can't believe you are going to talk yourself into submission simply because the case law is as perverted as people's ignorance of the law itself.

We need to flood the court with cases, and then refuse their orders if they do not comply. Eventually these cases will spill into the hands of juries, where rage against our banker-infested government will make the lawyers and judges squirm.

Don't go back into slavery simply because an Uncle Tom deceived you! I know the struggle seems BIGGER than what you thought it might be at the outset, but others are waking up everyday...you won't feel so alone and powerless for much longer.
(bolding added).

And this, from user "Chex":
I’m sorry but I just can’t take “frivolous” as an answer.
http://www.losthorizons.com/phpBB/viewt ... 8397#18397

Dear "Chex": Why don't you just mention that to the judge in open court one day, if you're ever faced with the possibility of a penalty for engaging in frivolous litigation? I'm sure the judge will be understanding.
:)

And, this from "Submarine Veteran":
Way to say it Patrick!

I certainly understand the way Rusty feels[,] and there are many good Americans who just finally give out under the relentless pressure.

I am currently fighting the "NFTL" issue in my local county[,] as well as having to fend off the result of that NFTL being the only negative mark on my credit report (and it's a doozy) and the impact that negative report has on aspects of my job.

My wife is understanding, but really not happy with the impacts this fight for the truth has on our life[,] and I get that too.

I had a great deal of time to ponder things during the months under the ocean [in the submarine service in the Navy] over those many years[,] and it really set things in concrete for me. Steeling myself mentally was critical to my sanity. When I discovered this fraud against the freedom of all Americans, I became outraged and have devoted myself to bringing this issue to justice.

I have also seen how the very mention of this topic brings such tremendous fear to the faces of others. Some give me a nervous laugh and comment that they'll visit me in prison. Others clearly have a "I'll wait and see" and "I'll be right behind you" response. These are the majority of the folks.......
(bolding added)
"My greatest fear is that the audience will beat me to the punch line." -- David Mamet
Famspear
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by Famspear »

We recall that losthorizoner user "Rusty" has recently begun realize some of the basic principles of law (and, impliedly to begin to snap out of at least some of the delusional thinking rampant among Peter Hendrickson's followers),which is making Pete's Preposterous Pontificators nervous. Rusty has also indicated that he is considering going to law school some day. The half-wit calling himself "Mountain Of Fire" responds to Rusty (bolding added):
Rusty,
Tell me please what benefit you think law school will give to you? I mean really I know past law grads, now all they have learned after spending thousands is to UNLEARN if they wish to enjoy liberty. Have you fallen victim to the conventional wisdom that They (attorneys) are the "real" professionals? Come on Rusty, what is it you can't do on your own?
http://www.losthorizons.com/phpBB/viewt ... 8401#18401

In next week's episode, Mountain Of Fire tells Rusty about do-it-on-your own root canal work, do-it-on-your own financial statement auditing, do-it-on-your own nuclear reactor construction, and do-it-on-your own brain surgery.

Mountain of Fire continues:
I understand if you simply want to join the ranks of the plunderers, but atleast be honest and say so. CPA's, Lawyers, are just fill in the blank people.
Ah yes, the old "CPAs and lawyers just fill in blanks in pre-printed forms" theory. You don't need them. What you need are the REAL LEGAL EXPERTS at losthorizons. People like Pontificating Peter and His Preposterous Pinheads. Why, look at the string of court victories those guys have managed to accumulate! Look at how victorious Joe Fennell was! And Andrew Scott! And Patrick Michael Mooney! And look at the "victory" achieved by the lost horizons people when they filed all that paperwork with the U.S. Supreme Court last week in Peter Hendrickson's case, only to have the Court reject Pete's petition on the following Monday! Ohhh... yes, those Cracking the Code people are real LEGAL EXPERTS!!!!

Mountain of Crap continues:
From what I have seen you have not been, you've been fighting and now a retreat? I can understand if you must due to health, sleepless nights, anxiety, etc. But please don't think these will subside by being educated in becoming an entrepreneur (attuner, aka attorney). When you do that[,] you can no longer tell the truth and remain in the BAR.

I wish you well, and just think you might be wise to reconsider your law school dreams, you might as well join the IRS it's the same game to me.
Just my opinion. and my two sense [sic], and after spending many thousands myself to learn law (even selling a house) your [sic] better off to go to georgegordon.org and learn the real fascinating truth. I warn you though you'll pay more than law school for this private (by invitation only ) law school, but you'll be closer to freedom and probably moreso than your wildest imagination.

Take care,
MOF
Gosh darn it, in that federal criminal tax case, why is Peter Hendrickson wasting time with "fill in the blank" people (i.e., lawyers) when he could have access to the wonderfully accurate legal skills of "Mountain of Fire"??!!!??

EDITED: For my own typos.
"My greatest fear is that the audience will beat me to the punch line." -- David Mamet
Lambkin
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by Lambkin »

Gosh darn it, in that federal criminal tax case, why is Peter Hendrickson wasting time with "fill in the blank" people (i.e., lawyers) when he could have access to the wonderfully accurate legal skills of "Mountain of Fire"??!!!??
Why indeed? Why isn't Pete pro se if he is the code meister?
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grixit
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by grixit »

This one goes out to the Savage Submariner:

Where can you get learnin'
Without that darn attornin'
Escape from negativity?
Break out of the nexus
That secretly effects us
Get yourself completely free?
Where can you learn to crack
Codes that hold us all back,
Rebut all tax mendacity?
Sign up with the warriors
Or take on the lawyers
For the sake of Liberty?

In the LostHeads
Yes you can pay for bad advice
In the LostHeads
Asking hard ones isn't nice!
In the LostHeads
Come on sovereigns make a stand
In the LostHeads
The revolution is at hand!
In the LostHeads
Those big liens are gonna come
In the LostHeads
Be prepared for martyrdumb!
Three cheers for the Lesser Evil!

10 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2
. . . . . . Dr Pepper
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . .. . . 4
Quixote
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by Quixote »

We recall that losthorizoner user "Rusty" has recently begun realize some of the basic principles of law (and, impliedly to begin to snap out of at least some of the delusional thinking rampant among Peter Hendrickson's followers),which is making Pete's Preposterous Pontificators nervous
It seems to me that Rusty has replaced one delusion with another, albeit safer, one. Rusty still thinks that Cracking the Code reveals the REAL LAW, but that he is subject to some unrelated law with no discernable source other than court decisions. He knows he can't win in court, but he doesn't know why.
"Here is a fundamental question to ask yourself- what is the goal of the income tax scam? I think it is a means to extract wealth from the masses and give it to a parasite class." Skankbeat
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by Lambkin »

Quixote wrote:
We recall that losthorizoner user "Rusty" has recently begun realize some of the basic principles of law (and, impliedly to begin to snap out of at least some of the delusional thinking rampant among Peter Hendrickson's followers),which is making Pete's Preposterous Pontificators nervous
It seems to me that Rusty has replaced one delusion with another, albeit safer, one. Rusty still thinks that Cracking the Code reveals the REAL LAW, but that he is subject to some unrelated law with no discernable source other than court decisions. He knows he can't win in court, but he doesn't know why.
I think this is more or less the SteveSy perspective, that the courts are wrong but you can't fight them, you'll lose because courts are dishonest, etc.
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by Famspear »

His Blowhardiness, PeterEricBlowhardMeister Hendrickson, now responds to the wayward "Rusty" (bolding added by me):
A couple of comments relevant to various things in this thread:

To begin with, Rusty says that "T.C. did exactly the same thing to me that D.C. and C.A. did to Pete - prefer hearsay over sworn testimony, and reverse the burden of proof from respondent to me. I'm a smart man, but I am not skilled enough to fight this kind of stuff, and do not have the resources to recover if I fail. "A man's got to know his own limitations."" Unfortunately, the actual lesson to be learned here is being missed.

As I have discussed in detail in the newsletter posts concerning the current petition to the Supreme Court, the nature of the lower courts' behavior in the lawsuit against Doreen and me to which Rusty refers renders their judgments void, and, as posted in the current edition, it has become clear to me that this was done deliberately in order to protect the actors from personal liability and to allow the bogus rulings to stand undisturbed for the sake of their PR value against the truth in the minds of those who look no deeper than the superficial. (I have said this to all of you a thousand times, and apparently must say it again: READ EVERY NEWSLETTER! EVERY NEWSLETTER.)

The same can be said about Rusty's case. Indeed, it is my understanding that, just as is the case in this "lawsuit" against Doreen and me, Rusty hasn't actually haven't ever had any property taken from him in connection with the circumstances over which he is suing, and in connection with which a similarly meaningless ruling was issued. He simply hasn't gotten his property returned yet. This is, of course, property which the feds would have been keeping-- and perhaps then some-- had Rusty not learned the truth about the tax, and thus known to demand its return in the first place, the prosecution of which claim can continue as things now stand, but which would have been forever foregone had he remained a victim of ignorance.

Again, just as in the "lawsuit" against Doreen and me, the Tax Court DIDN'T actually dispute anything taught in CtC-- instead it deliberately contorted itself itself so as to avoid having to address what is taught in CtC, per Rusty's account. Thus, as Patrick observes elsewhere in this thread, the court thereby actually affirms that teaching. Remember, the court wouldn't dodge the contest if it had any way of winning it; that it DID dodge that contest must be afforded its due significance. Further, of course, the government creeping off with a "ruling" that simply denies Rusty his victory is hardly a win for its side, either. In fact, it is a flat-out loss, in reality, since in failing to address what Rusty presented the government has conceded that it cannot prevail on the merits, but can only manage to delay and obstruct. This may be an annoyance for Rusty, but it is solid evidence of who's right about the law for everyone else, and should simply be viewed as more traction for the spreading of the truth and more fuel for the ongoing effort to restore the rule of law.

On another matter, reference is made in this thread to Joe Fennell's petition to tax court, and his loss. It is important that it be understood that Joe's case involved years before even the publishing of CtC, and in regard to which he had ignored "notices of deficiency" and passed up his opportunity to contest the associated assertions of liability for years in which he had filed no returns (or "Schiff" returns-- I can't recall which, offhand). Joe subsequently argued that the NODs were defective or illegitimate, and had points to make in that regard (even if hyper-technical points), but his case can in no way be cited as an example of a litigant prosecuting a case involving CtC-educated behavior. At best it was a case of a newly CtC-educated litigant trying to recover from bad past practices by belatedly invoking new knowledge.

Early on in this thread there is a discussion of the significance of 'case law', and how it is to be understood. That discussion misses some important points. It is certainly true that what is really just "dicta" is in and of itself largely irrelevant in establishing meaningful precedent, but even that is not entirely so. What a court says in the course of a decision often indicates its view and understanding of a subject, and how it would rule if the immediate object of the dicta were actually squarely before that court. This is why dicta is routinely cited, and by the government no less than by any other litigant.
On the comments about precedent and dicta, it sounds like Pete has been reading my posts in a thread on another web site over the past few days, or else he never saw my comments but has actually learned something from all his "study" over the years. In any case, I give him his due on these comments about dicta. Of course, Pete is just as bad as his followers about citing dicta and then arguing that the words somehow mean that the law is somehow something other than what the courts have actually ruled.

Pete continues:
Further, of course, what the sly and dissembling 'Larry Williams' of the IRS (and/or its invested, symbiotic "tax profession") wishes to obscure is that the words of the courts cited throughout CtC, and in related or expansionary work such as that at http://www.losthorizons.com/Intro.pdf , ARE fully consistent with, and reflective of, what was actually decided by the courts in the cases involved. It is 'Larry Williams' and the IRS that are reduced to trotting out completely irrelevant "dicta" from cases like Latham and Sullivan, in which the courts explicitly say that the matter to which the government-cited dicta relates IS NOT actually before the court, and IS NOT reflected in the actual decisions, or in which the court actually says nothing meaningful-- and these are the best these mendacious thugs can come up with! (See http://losthorizons.com/tax/faq.htm#Frivolous for more on this.)
Uh, oh, Pete, you're off into the weeds again. Fortunately for you, your followers are no better than you are at separating precedent from dicta in cases like Sullivan.
Finally, why is anyone in this community paying the least attention to self-interested prevaricators like 'Larry Williams', or other purveyors of disinformation from places like quatloos? Surely you all understand that their mission is to confuse you, discourage you, and lead you back into the pen!

Does it not occur to you to wonder why folks like this spend their time arguing with you, or communicating with you at all, in any fashion? Do you imagine that they do so out of what they mean to be altruism? That they spend their time on you because they're just looking out for their fellow Americans out of the sincere goodness of the hearts, and generosity of their spirits? People, grow up! Your mother might do such a thing, for you. No one else will. 'Larry' has an agenda, and it does not involve looking after your best interests. In any event, unless 'Larry Williams' is arguing on behalf of the rule of law, who cares what he or anyone else of his kind has to say, regardless of his motives?
http://www.losthorizons.com/phpBB/viewt ... 8480#18480
"My greatest fear is that the audience will beat me to the punch line." -- David Mamet
Famspear
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by Famspear »

Oh, and at the expense of beating a dead horse, Pete. I (Famspear, "Larry Williams") am not "self interested," and I am not a "prevaricator."

You, Pete Hendrickson, are a liar, and YOU are definitely "self interested" in this matter. I'm not the one in trouble, fella. And my life, financially and otherwise, is not affected by what happens to you and your tax scam.
"My greatest fear is that the audience will beat me to the punch line." -- David Mamet
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by Famspear »

Regarding Pete's comments about precedent versus dicta, it's possible that Pete has been following the discussion and comments I have been making in lecturing some familiar members of the cast of characters from losthorizons (including Rusty and SubVet and one or two others I believe I recognize) in a thread that began here, back on May 9th:

http://freedomwatch.uservoice.com/pages ... on?page=10

After I explained the concept of precedent several days ago, one of the losthorizontals was astute enough to use the term "dicta" in a sentence, which term I then proceeded to explain as well.
"My greatest fear is that the audience will beat me to the punch line." -- David Mamet
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by wserra »

Famspear wrote:His Blowhardiness, PeterEricBlowhardMeister Hendrickson, now responds to the wayward "Rusty" (bolding added by me):
... the nature of the lower courts' behavior in the lawsuit against Doreen and me to which Rusty refers renders their judgments void
Now there is a passage I would prominently archive, were I a federal prosecutor.
"A wise man proportions belief to the evidence."
- David Hume
Famspear
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by Famspear »

Blowhard Hendrickson wrote:
On another matter, reference is made in this thread to Joe Fennell's petition to tax court, and his loss. It is important that it be understood that Joe's case involved years before even the publishing of CtC, and in regard to which he had ignored "notices of deficiency" and passed up his opportunity to contest the associated assertions of liability for years in which he had filed no returns (or "Schiff" returns-- I can't recall which, offhand). Joe subsequently argued that the NODs were defective or illegitimate, and had points to make in that regard (even if hyper-technical points), but his case can in no way be cited as an example of a litigant prosecuting a case involving CtC-educated behavior. At best it was a case of a newly CtC-educated litigant trying to recover from bad past practices by belatedly invoking new knowledge.
Well, gee, I don't know, Pete. Here is what Joe Fennell argued in his amended petition:
Respondent's [Commissioner's] alleged 'assessments' of federal income tax against-petitioner [Joseph Fennell] are based upon respondent's deliberate inclusion into petitioner's income of pay received in exchange for petitioner's non-federally privileged private sector labor.

Non-federally-privileged private sector labor is not properly the subject of an excise under the excise laws of the United States.
(bolding added).

The Tax Court ruled that Fennell's "challenge" was "frivolous and groundless." See page 2, Order of Dismissal and Decision, June 17, 2008, Joseph Alan Fennell v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, docket # 26285-07L, United States Tax Court. The Tax Court specifically referred to the above-quoted verbiage as being "the gist" of Fennell's "challenge." See footnote 4, Order of Dismissal and Decision, June 17, 2008, Joseph Alan Fennell v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, docket # 26285-07L, United States Tax Court.
"My greatest fear is that the audience will beat me to the punch line." -- David Mamet
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by Famspear »

Hendrickson seems to be trying to get his followers to ignore the Fennell case by arguing that because Fennell merely argued CtC in court but did not properly "use" CtC on the actual tax returns, the loss doesn't really "count" as a loss. Yet, the Court did not say:
Hey, Mr. Joe Fennell, the reason the Court is ruling against you is that you didn't use CtC on your tax returns, or you didn't use CtC properly on those returns, or you didn't argue CtC early enough in the process, etc., etc. CtC is really the proper statement of what the law is, and had you, Joe, used CtC properly on your returns, you would have won this case.
Instead, the Court ruled that Fennell's CHALLENGE -- which was clearly based on the CtC argument as shown in the quoted material from Fennell's amended petition, and which argument the Court SPECIFICALLY stated was "the gist" of Fennell's "challenge" -- was ruled by the Court to be "frivolous."
"My greatest fear is that the audience will beat me to the punch line." -- David Mamet
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by Duke2Earl »

Hendrickson can say whatever he wants but the result will be exactly the same. He will lose. And that is all we have said here all along. He can talk about how unfair it is. He can say whatever he wants about the courts. He can see all sorts of conspiracies. But at the end of the day he will still lose. Every federal court in the land has been as clear as humanly posible on one point... individuals are subject to income tax on their wages. And absolutely nothing that Hendrickson can say will change that.
My choice early in life was to either be a piano player in a whorehouse or a politican. And to tell the truth there's hardly any difference.

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webhick
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by webhick »

Famspear wrote:Hendrickson seems to be trying to get his followers to ignore the Fennell case by arguing that because Fennell merely argued CtC in court but did not properly "use" CtC on the actual tax returns, the loss doesn't really "count" as a loss. Yet, the Court did not say:
Hey, Mr. Joe Fennell, the reason the Court is ruling against you is that you didn't use CtC on your tax returns, or you didn't use CtC properly on those returns, or you didn't argue CtC early enough in the process, etc., etc. CtC is really the proper statement of what the law is, and had you, Joe, used CtC properly on your returns, you would have won this case.
Instead, the Court ruled that Fennell's CHALLENGE -- which was clearly based on the CtC argument as shown in the quoted material from Fennell's amended petition, and which argument the Court SPECIFICALLY stated was "the gist" of Fennell's "challenge" -- was ruled by the Court to be "frivolous."
Hey Darth, the reason why you keep throwing out wrong guesses as to why people using CTC are losing is that you have shoved your head up your ass, or your head is shoved up your ass too far, or you shoved your head up your ass too soon, etc., etc. Shoving your head up your ass is how you keep ignoring the losses and had you, Darth, not shoved your head up your ass so well, there would still be enough ambient light to see it.

On a side note, we are all impressed with how long you've been able to hold your breath and your ability to contort.
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by Famspear »

webhick wrote:Hey Darth, the reason why you keep throwing out wrong guesses as to why people using CTC are losing is that you have shoved your head up your ass, or your head is shoved up your ass too far, or you shoved your head up your ass too soon, etc., etc. Shoving your head up your ass is how you keep ignoring the losses and had you, Darth, not shoved your head up your ass so well, there would still be enough ambient light to see it.
Hey gal, you got a way o' sayin' it that gets to THE GIST o' thangs.
"My greatest fear is that the audience will beat me to the punch line." -- David Mamet
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Re: Kneejerk commentary at LostHeads?

Post by LPC »

Peter Hendrickson (with bolding by Famspear) wrote:Again, just as in the "lawsuit" against Doreen and me, the Tax Court DIDN'T actually dispute anything taught in CtC-- instead it deliberately contorted itself itself so as to avoid having to address what is taught in CtC, per Rusty's account. Thus, as Patrick observes elsewhere in this thread, the court thereby actually affirms that teaching. Remember, the court wouldn't dodge the contest if it had any way of winning it; that it DID dodge that contest must be afforded its due significance.
This represents a new low-water mark in the jurisprudential wading pool that is the tax denier movement.

According to PH, when a court rules against you but doesn't use exactly the words you think the court needs to recite in order to contradict you, not only does it not count as a rejection of your claims but it's actually an affirmation of your claims, because why else would the court "dodge the contest"?

This is, once again, beyond the delusional and well into the pathological.
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(And author of the Tax Protester FAQ: evans-legal.com/dan/tpfaq.html)
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