An Open Letter to Pete's Followers on Lost Horizons

[Gregg]

I know not many of the people who this is intended for will read it, I know even fewer will take it to heart, but someone has to say it, and I promise you if you'l just listen you might change your path and possibly so something that you'll eventually realize was the right thing. But first, I double dog dare any of you to post it over on the LH site, where I'm sure it would be quickly taken down, truth is not something they take real kindly to over there, but a guy can dream, no?

Some of us here make fun of you, quite a bit, and deep down it should trouble you that a place dominated by lawyers, accountants and tax professionals of other stripes consider your entire premise something to be laughed at.

Well, it goes with the territory. Take a look at your fellow posters, the "owls" as Pete deemed them, are any of them having any success?

How about your own in house expert, the self proclaimed guru of the Internal Revenue Code, a person so humble he says with a straight face that anything you see anywhere about taxes that does not agree with his interpretation is wrong.

Of course, if you have a question you want him to clear up for you, for the next few years the best way to get an answer is to relay the query through his wife to his prison restricted E-mail account.

Yes, step back and make an honest evaluation of how the whole CTC thing is working out. THe whole premise is pages of people who filed a frivolous return and were mistakenly issued refunds because the IRS turns out to be as infallible as any other government agency and the fact is most returns are not seen by actual human beings during the rush to speedily issue refunds, and the returns with mistakes are often not caught until later. This has happened to quite a few of you, and as mush as all the advice about avoiding it hasn't worked FOR A SINGLE ONE OF YOU YET. And all of you who have pursued your wrongly filed returns, either first attempts or amended, NOT A SINGLE ONE OF YOU HAS WON YET. And of all the people who have ever been taken to court, including your leader, NOT A SINGLE ONE OF YOU HAS WON YET. So, how many times do you have to lose in how many venues before it occurs to you that just maybe, you're wrong?

And you are wrong. Some of you have run up over $100,000 in penalties just for being wrong, and how much would have you saved if you had never caught the delusion and just paid your taxes? How many of you have a spouse who is getting a little tired by all this? How many of you are likely to lose your home because of this? How many are going to go to prison if you don't stop?

Think, and I mean think hard. Can't you see how silly some of you are? You have a member encouraging you to start arresting Federal Judges (please don't try that, US Marshalls have a severely under developed senses of humor about that), people spouting common law (wrongly) in ways that if followed to conclusion would result in anarchy, strange and disturbing theories about how the world and the courts work some, in the tradition of your leader in prison, twist the english language to the breaking point in defiance of both common sense and settled law.

Really, come to your senses, people are getting in serious trouble, people are screwing up their lives in ways they will never recover from, ever, so don't go there. Pete is wrong. So was Jim Jones, David Koresh, Ed Brown and any number of other deluded leaders who led their flocks to grief. I hope some of you have the common sense to step back from
the edge, put down the Kool Aid, and come back to reality. Before it's too late.

[Edited to insert line breaks so my eyeballs wouldn't bleed - The Observer]

[silversopp]

*sigh* we all know how this will end up, right? The counter argument will look something like this:

1. Quatloos posters are undercover IRS agents and/or paid by the government to perpetuate the income tax scam

2. This "open letter" was written because the government is trying to scare people off from using the tried and true CTC method.

3. So and so got a big refund. He hasn't been thrown into prison or had his doublewide repo'ed, so the CTC method works.

4. Stand Tall Warriors!!

5. Btw, I discovered the magic word that Pete got wrong from the last living son of Methusalah (he was 3257 years old). He gave me this knowledge on his death bed, so it's not hearsay. Please buy my new book "Shattering the Code" and use the method described there to avoid paying income taxes. Also, I'm writing a book that describes how you too can live for thousands of years if you just avoid all Western Medicine.

6. A new Guru has been annointed. Repeat cycle.

[bmielke]

*sigh* we all know how this will end up, right? The counter argument will look something like this:

1. Quatloos posters are undercover IRS agents and/or paid by the government to perpetuate the income tax scam

Apparently my checks have been lost in the mail, or do you have to be here a certain amount of time first?

2. This "open letter" was written because the government is trying to scare people off from using the tried and true CTC method.

Yep because Jail time just isn't scary enough

3. So and so got a big refund. He hasn't been thrown into prison or had his doublewide repo'ed, so the CTC method works.

I sprayed a skunk down with 25 rounds of .223, and I didn't hit my neighbors cows, so shooting at night is a great idea

4. Stand Tall Warriors!!

What do you even say to that?

5. Btw, I discovered the magic word that Pete got wrong from the last living son of Methusalah (he was 3257 years old). He gave me this knowledge on his death bed, so it's not hearsay. Please buy my new book "Shattering the Code" and use the method described there to avoid paying income taxes. Also, I'm writing a book that describes how you too can live for thousands of years if you just avoid all Western Medicine.

I've got this bridge, it's really old and it's in Brooklyn I really need to get rid of it, I can make a deal with you, it will be cheap

6. A new Guru has been annointed. Repeat cycle.

Well that's how I would respond to these idiots. I can't believe how stupid they really are.

[Brandybuck]

The only way SOME of these people will get the clue is when the judge's gavel raps. For a few others it might be when they see the peeling green paint on the prison cell. Those very few will quickly reevaluate their "truth".

But most will never change their minds. There comes a point when bending your brain, that you bend it too much and it snaps. The die hard tax deniers have broken brains, and they will indeed die hard. The Good Lord Himself could call them a fool to their faces but they still will reject reality. They will rather lose their homes, lose their wives and husbands, lose their children, lose their jobs, lose everything of value to them, before admitting they were wrong.

[webhick]

4. Stand Tall Warriors!!

What do you even say to that?

"Those who sit end up with less fines and penalties."

[Cathulhu]

The only way SOME of these people will get the clue is when the judge's gavel raps. For a few others it might be when they see the peeling green paint on the prison cell. Those very few will quickly reevaluate their "truth".

But most will never change their minds. There comes a point when bending your brain, that you bend it too much and it snaps. The die hard tax deniers have broken brains, and they will indeed die hard. The Good Lord Himself could call them a fool to their faces but they still will reject reality. They will rather lose their homes, lose their wives and husbands, lose their children, lose their jobs, lose everything of value to them, before admitting they were wrong.

Dick Simkanin is obvious living proof of this. Went to jail AGAIN because he still isn't wrong, right?

[Gregg]

Well, I came home today to find, much to my disappointment, that no one has had the stones to cut and paste this over at LH.

Come on Harvey, are you afraid to stand tall? Are the arguments over there so weak that they can't bear the forces of logic?

You can even (and I would expect no less) point it out as an example of how desperate the big evil gub'mint is getting. Though I've never worked for the IRS, you can truthfully call me a former minion of the criminal banksters, I once worked for a Federal Reserve Bank ya know, and even better, you can show how since I went to school in England I'm a lifetime stooge of the Queen, the Pope (funny how none of the nuts ever see the conflict in that connection BTW), the Rothschilds, etc... as I also studied in Ingolstadt Bavaria if you know your conspiracy theories well enough you know that alone makes me Illuminati (and I even taught at the same school that Adam Wieshaupt. I mean, if you want to spin it right, I'm just about everything besides Obama's Nigerian Birf Cetificate!

C'mon chickenshit, Stand Tall!

[Number Six]

A commendable try, Gregg. The problem with trying to de-program tax protestors of their leader's teachings is that the nonsense that is being spewed is so pervasive; from the low-level clerk to the business owner, they all believe something that is questionable, I have spoken to many who subscribe to some irrational conspiracy theory and some secretly admire the tax protestors.

I could give over a hundred reasons why citizens and individuals should get an accountant or CPA, there is a large range in terms of what they charge and their scruples or lack thereof, they are pretty easy to find, and just get it done. Arguing with the IRS is like arguing with a computer: And every government has had their inscrutable systems for raising taxes. Most of the non-filer or tax protestor's fellow citizens will see them as crooks and defame them as such, and their "war", "struggle" or defiance will just frustrate what may be legitimate political concerns. There is nothing that causes a drop in status like a criminal indictment and poverty. The ideological and legal resistance is seen by most citizens as a smokescreen for greater criminality--what else is he/she hiding. Kind of hard to live that infamy down.

[lorne]

Number Six, good to see you on the trail stumping for Peter Schiff.

Gregg, why not register for a LostHorizons login and post over there? just a thought. While I can't speak for Harvester I've been in communication with him and so far the Hendrickson method has been successful for him; no court, no liens, levies etc. Although I gather taht he feels there's a bit more deception involved than just a misapplied tax. He takes it beyond what Pete does, with that notion of a secret financial war is intriguing.

My question for Gregg is, just economically speaking, do you think our country is on the right track?

[bmielke]

The problem with trying to de-program tax protestors

I took a psychology class in High School, I was a senior and all th eguy did was try an hypnotize us and make us watch movies. One of the movies was about deprograming cult members, if we ever find a TP we like I am more than willing to assist in the deprograming, I have a graden hose, hot bright lights, and batan, and I will buy the bear mace and taser. It will be fun!

On topic though, the problem as I see it is that no one left over there wants to get banned it is there one remaining lifeline now that petey has a number behind his name. Maybe you need to form your own website, may I suggest crakingthecodecostmeeverythingieverhad.com.

[Joey Smith]

so far the Hendrickson method has been successful for him; no court, no liens, levies etc.

That's because he's a 13-year old kid whose only cash comes from his weekly allowance.

[Lorax]

I tried to register at Lost Horizons, and Pete asked me how I got my copy of his book. Being the upstanding kind of guy I am, I honestly told him I didn't have a copy, and he told me I couldn't post on the forum till I bought one, which is obviously never going to happen.

As for Harvester, from what I understand, he's never used the CtC "method." He's simply not filing his tax returns, and he doesn't work for an employer that's reporting his wages, if any, to the IRS.

[bmielke]

[...]with that notion of a secret financial war is intriguing.

Seriously? Have you considered psychatric help?

[Brandybuck]

My question for Gregg is, just economically speaking, do you think our country is on the right track?

What the fudge does that have to do with Gregg's letter?

[Number Six]

[...]with that notion of a secret financial war is intriguing.

Seriously? Have you considered psychatric help?

This psychologist may be helpful for those who are self-motivated: http://www.threeminutetherapy.com/reviews.html

He charges around $150 an hour even on a phone consultation basis.

[wserra]

That's because he's a 13-year old kid whose only cash comes from his weekly allowance.

Or a 43-year-old liar.

[bmielke]

[...]with that notion of a secret financial war is intriguing.

Seriously? Have you considered psychatric help?

This psychologist may be helpful for those who are self-motivated: http://www.threeminutetherapy.com/reviews.html

He charges around $150 an hour even on a phone consultation basis.

I was thinking Lorne might need chemical therapy. Lots of it. It is a short step from "Secret Financial Wars" to "the voices in my head told me to do it."

[Famspear]

My question for Gregg is, just economically speaking, do you think our country is on the right track?

What the fudge does that have to do with Gregg's letter?

Yes, but it's not really on topic. This kind of question, in this context, which has nothing to do with whether our country is "on the right track," highlights the typical Tax Protester's Thinking:

1. I think the country is on the wrong track. (so far, so good)

2. Part of the problem is that federal income taxes are too high/unfair/too complicated. (so far, so good)

3. Therefore, I must find some rationale for opposing federal income taxes. (so far, so good)

4. Oh, wait, here's one: If federal income taxes are too high/unfair/too complicated, then maybe they should be illegal/unconstitutional/"misapplied" or don't apply to me. (he's off in the weeds now)

5. I therefore conclude that the federal income tax is illegal/unconstitutional/missapplied/doesn't apply to me. (now he's stuck in the swamp)

6. Let's see, where can I find something to back up this conclusion? (this is not going to end well)

7. Ah, here we are: loads and loads of wackadooster web sites on the internet that argue that federal income taxes are illegal/unconstitutional/missapplied/don't apply to me.

8. And LOOOOK! These web sites even have quotations from statutes and court cases (some of the "quotes" aren't even fake)! Never mind that none of the courts in these cases have actually ruled what the wackadoosters say (or imply) that the courts ruled.

9. Hey, there's no need for me to consult with 99.9999% of the experts, even though the experts point out that these web sites are a bunch of hooey and that every single argument in the web sites has been rejected by one hundred percent of the courts every single time! Shucks, I'll just ignore the experts (I'll just argue that they have a "vested interest" in perpetuating the tax system) and I'll repeatedly cackle that "the courts are corrupt, the courts are corrupt." "Stand tall, warriors!"

10. Instead, I'll read and believe the writings of "tax gurus" like:

---->William Benson (ex-con, spent time in federal prison for tax convictions; his own "16th Amendment was not properly ratified" argument was not successful for him in his own criminal tax case)

---->Robert Clarkson (now deceased; spent time in federal prison on federal tax charges)

---->Peter E. ("Blowhard") Hendrickson (now in federal prison for using his own Cracking the Code tax scheme on his own returns; a two-time loser on federal criminal tax matters)

---->Kent Hovind (now in federal prison, convicted in a scheme in which among other things he falsely claimed that his income wasn't taxable)

---->Eddie Kahn (now in federal prison for federal tax crimes)

---->Bonita Lynne Meredith (now in federal prison for tax crimes)

---->Larken Rose (served his sentence in federal prison for tax crime -- using his own stupid "861" scheme)

---->Irwin Schiff (a clueless three time loser, now in federal prison for the third time -- will probably die in prison)

---->Lindsey K. Springer (now in federal prison, 15 year sentence; pushed the stupid "OMB control number/PRA" argument over and over with zero success)

---->Oscar A. Stilley (now in federal prison, a 15 year sentence; he was also disbarred)

11. And when my current goofball theory doesn't seem to work, I'll just hop to another one, like Pete Hendrickson did.

12. Or, maybe I'll be like Harvester/Nationwide/Libre/johnthetaxist and just copy and paste links to every wackadooster web site I can find espousing every goofy theory under the sun. And I'll proclaim that salvation is "imminent" -- it's just around the corner..... just around the corner..... just around the corner..... just around the corner..... just around the corner.....

[Gregg]

Number Six, good to see you on the trail stumping for Peter Schiff.

Gregg, why not register for a LostHorizons login and post over there? just a thought. While I can't speak for Harvester I've been in communication with him and so far the Hendrickson method has been successful for him; no court, no liens, levies etc. Although I gather taht he feels there's a bit more deception involved than just a misapplied tax. He takes it beyond what Pete does, with that notion of a secret financial war is intriguing.

My question for Gregg is, just economically speaking, do you think our country is on the right track?

I tried to register, I was denied. I could have lied about who I was, but unlike Pete, I won't do that for a website.

Harvester is at best getting away with a few years of the IRS not noticing him yet, or not being worth noticing at all. Beyond his beliefs in Hendrickson, well, the more he talks to more stupid he makes himself look.

As to "My question for Gregg", go back and find a my post in regards to who I will discuss economics with, even if you had met the initial requirements you've posted enough stupidity to make it quite clear you don't make the cut. Also, it's an incredibly vague question and either answer (yes or no) is correct, no matter who you ask. It's on the right track in that we're not heading towards communism, and it's not on the right track because we are heading towards communism, with a stop by socialism on the way.
And people like you, Havester, Glenn Beck (it's a long damn list) are at fault because all of you, in small forums or large, are trying and sometimes succeeding at convincing otherwise sane people that batshit crazy ideas (like anything Harvester posts) have somewhere a person who thinks they might be good ideas.

Broken window principle, look it up.

[wserra]

why not register for a LostHorizons login and post over there?

I tried - using "wserra", as I do everywhere I post - and was denied.

Can't have opinions contrary to those of the scammer-in-chief.