notorial dissent wrote:I hate to tell them, but you don't don't patent something like a card, you trademark it, and even that is nothing great.
U.S. patent law allows for patents on "business methods," with the result that patents have been issued for (among other things) tax strategies. See, for example, United States Patent Application 20100125536, titled "Techniques for Illustrating and Analyzing College Savings Plans."
So it's possible that a novel way of linking a credit card to precious metals might qualify for a U.S. patent.
I agree on all counts, with the following provisos:
1. when has anyone involved with von Nutbert ever told the truth about anything, and why should we start accepting anything they say now as fact?,
and
2. having worked for a very good patent/trademark attorney once upon a time, I know what it costs to do either or both, and how long it takes to accomplish same, and I seriously doubt that they have had either the time and more particularly the money to have done so.
Let’s say I have a really hard time believing they could someone willing to work for Libbies.
The fact that you sincerely and wholeheartedly believe that the “Law of Gravity” is unconstitutional and a violation of your sovereign rights, does not absolve you of adherence to it.
Actually nobody seems to want to work for Libbies. About ten years ago Media Bypass started touting Von NautHaus and NORFED and Liberty drachmas, with display ads in every issue, and glowing feature articles in alternating issues. After a little more than a year Media Bypass had to announce that it wouldn't accept any more Libbies as payment for a subscription (taking drachmas worth only $6 at a pretended value of twice that was killing its profit margin). After another year Media Bypass went through a management shake-up and stopped mentioning NORFED and Libbies altogether (evidently the display ads in previous issues had been gifts to Von NautHaus from the previous managers). A year after that Media Bypass collapsed and blew away.
...
8. Liberty Gold Card Receives Patent!
I am pleased to inform you that Liberty Gold Card, the world's first payment card system that transacts in gold and silver, has received their patent. If you are a qualified investor and want to be apart of this exciting project, please contact Al Wagner, CEO for Liberty Gold International, a New Zealand corporation via: 1awesumcpa@comcast.net.
A Google® search for "Liberty Gold Card" & Patent finds two copies of this (probably three when Google® indexes this thread), and one note on the Trademark registration for "Liberty Gold Card", issued to "Liberty Payment Systems, LLC", which is probably not associated with vonNuthouse.
[edited to note that Google is a registered trademark]
There is one US patent application listed with Bernard von Nothaus as inventor.
It is US 2008-0167965 A1, entitled "APPARATUS, SYSTEM, AND METHOD FOR EXTRACTING REAL WORLD VALUE FROM A VIRTUAL ACCOUNT" and is shown in the US Patent & Trademark Office register as "Ready for Examination" (and is certainly not granted). An application has also been made under the Patent Cooperation Treaty (WO2008006112). The European designation of this is shown as "deemed withdrawn" on the European Patents registry. The search report and written opinion of the International Search Authority suggests that there is considerable prior art.
Imagine that. I'm shocked. How could that possibly be? He's been feeding on his gullible, true believer marks for years and now is exposed to be a liar? Incomprehensible.
Next thing you know, he'll be a convicted federal felon spending time with his equally delusional TP compatriots.
All the States incorporated daughter corporations for transaction of business in the 1960s or so. - Some voice in Van Pelt's head, circa 2006.
The Dog wrote:There is one US patent application listed with Bernard von Nothaus as inventor.
It is US 2008-0167965 A1, entitled "APPARATUS, SYSTEM, AND METHOD FOR EXTRACTING REAL WORLD VALUE FROM A VIRTUAL ACCOUNT"
Which sounds suspiciously like "apparatus, system, and method for separating fools from their money."
Dan Evans
Foreman of the Unified Citizens' Grand Jury for Pennsylvania
(And author of the Tax Protester FAQ: evans-legal.com/dan/tpfaq.html)
"Nothing is more terrible than ignorance in action." Johann Wolfgang von Goethe.
Harvester wrote:For any involved in the closing of Liberty Dollar, I'd like to personally thank you . .
for making these much more valuable .. ..
Only to other morons like you. Looking at EBay, I can see that the 1oz 2008 liberty dollars are currently bid at $17.50 (less than the spot price of silver). You cannot assume that the "Buy It Now" prices are reflective of the market because those prices are set by the seller and only reflect their unrealistic views. If you look at the entries that contain bids, there are only a few bidders and the prices are much lower.
BTW, that was a GREAT investment! Buy a liberty dollar for $40+ that was never worth more than $20 and currently only worth about $18.
Light travels faster than sound, which is why some people appear bright, until you hear them speak.
Harvester wrote:For any involved in the closing of Liberty Dollar, I'd like to personally thank you for making these much more valuable .. ..
Only to other morons like you. Looking at EBay, I can see that the 1oz 2008 liberty dollars are currently bid at $17.50 (less than the spot price of silver). You cannot assume that the "Buy It Now" prices are reflective of the market because those prices are set by the seller and only reflect their unrealistic views. If you look at the entries that contain bids, there are only a few bidders and the prices are much lower.
BTW, that was a GREAT investment! Buy a liberty dollar for $40+ that was never worth more than $20 and currently only worth about $18.
I might also add that a basic law of numismatics, like in so many other economic areas, is that of supply and demand. An old friend of mine once kept an eye out for coins from St. Pierre and Miquelon, two French islands off the coast of Canada (and the only two remnants of France's old "New World" colonies). His premise was that these coins had a very small mintage and would thus be scarce and valuable; but since most people have never even heard of the two islands; most of those don't know where they are; and most of these people couldn't care less about them, the coins are still dirt cheap.
At coin shows, if I see items like Liberty Dollars at all, they are in the dealer's tokens and medals book, or else they are loose in their display cases, along with other silver pieces (like, say, a one ounce silver medal to commemorate the 200th anniversary of Podunk, Massachusetts [yes, there is such a place]) which are essentially sold as so much silver bullion. If you try to sell these things to a dealer, you will not get very much for them -- certainly, they will have no numismatic value beyond their metallic content. You might get someone who has heard of Liberty Dollars and wants one for his or her collection; but such people are almost always too bright to have bought them from the original source, and will be very unlikely to pay any premium for them.
Last edited by Pottapaug1938 on Tue Jun 22, 2010 1:51 pm, edited 2 times in total.
"We've been attacked by the intelligent, educated segment of the culture." -- Pastor Ray Mummert, Dover, PA, during an attempt to introduce creationism -- er, "intelligent design", into the Dover Public Schools
notorial dissent wrote:I hate to tell them, but you don't don't patent something like a card, you trademark it, and even that is nothing great.
U.S. patent law allows for patents on "business methods," with the result that patents have been issued for (among other things) tax strategies. See, for example, United States Patent Application 20100125536, titled "Techniques for Illustrating and Analyzing College Savings Plans."
So it's possible that a novel way of linking a credit card to precious metals might qualify for a U.S. patent.
I certainly hope they disclosed the European search report to the USPTO. If not - even if the patent is granted - it could be unenforceable for inequitable conduct.
Pottapaug1938 wrote:You might get someone who has heard of Liberty Dollars and wants one for his or her collection; but such people are almost always too bright to have bought them from the original source, and will be very unlikely to pay any premium for them.
I might buy one in a year or two when everyone has forgotten about them for the conversation value, but not for bullion investment.
Are you saying that Ron Paul serves as a convenient chew toy to keep stupid puppies occupied so they don't roll in the garbage? -grixit
iplawyer wrote:I certainly hope they disclosed the European search report to the USPTO. If not - even if the patent is granted - it could be unenforceable for inequitable conduct.
Cheers.
The PCT application was searched at the USPTO.
Given that the applicant appears to be using a firm of IP law attornies, I doubt that they would make that mistake.
It may well be that someone trying to sell LDs will get LESS than the metallic value. The assumption that its stated ingredient of 1 troy ounce of pure silver is true is simply an assumption. Given all the hankypanky in which the company has been involved, someone may suspect another goldbrick fraud and either insist on either a metallurgical test or else a drastic discount.
Critical or at least most relevant bit from latest Liberty Dollar site:
Liberty Dollar is temporarily closed until after the trial.
The rest is just the usual self serving drivel that von Nuthouse has been posting since this started.
The fact that you sincerely and wholeheartedly believe that the “Law of Gravity” is unconstitutional and a violation of your sovereign rights, does not absolve you of adherence to it.
Briefly put, Glenn Beck is heavily advertising a "gold investment" operation called Goldline, with many commercials touting the advantages of investing in and owning gold.
However, it turns out that customers who came to invest or buy bullion gold at something approaching the market price for the metal are instead switched to invest in collectors' gold coins, paying a premium for "collectibles" well above the market price for metallic gold. It turns out that, especially with the viggorish charged by Goldline, this is a sucker's bet and the customers will not see a profit for, probably, decades.
The fact that you sincerely and wholeheartedly believe that the “Law of Gravity” is unconstitutional and a violation of your sovereign rights, does not absolve you of adherence to it.
I'm a hard-line, hard-core conservative and I despise Beck.
While he serves some limited purpose in that he wakes a few people up (and, to his great credit, drives liberals absolutely nuts,) every time he opens his mouth within my earshot (very rare) or I read something he said or wrote, I cringe.
However, being the unsophisticated economic advocate (and entertainer) that he is, it's not at all surprising that he would be complicit in promoting high-transaction-cost "investments" to his equally or moreso unsophisticated followers. He knows the side on which his bread is buttered.
The fact that any disappointed takers of the advice can't figure that out leaves them with only themselves to blame. Beck didn't hold a gun to their head, nor did anyone whom Beck has promoted.
It's really very simple. People who don't know what they're doing shouldn't take advice from radio or TV personalities or their advertisers.
If they want gold, there are a multitude of avenues to take a cash or leveraged position: large, reputable bullion dealers, bullion coins sold directly by many governments, exchange-traded metal ETFs, individual exchange-traded gold stocks, gold mutual funds, exchange-traded 50 and 100 ounce futures contracts, exchange-traded options on futures, gold stock indexes and ETFs, all of which have low to minuscule transaction costs.
I say that as someone with some idea of which I speak, my largest notional outright directional position in gold (futures) having been about $75 million, held at various times alternately long and short and always with butterfly spread positions (back when they were still tax-effective at converting short-term to long-term gains) amounting to tens of millions more. I only mention the butterflies because they always had some degree of directional bias to them, no matter what Congress or the IRS says. Too bad they were outlawed.
In any case, the fact that numerous yahoos aren't bright enough to know that Beck isn't an investment adviser one should listen to and then somehow got burned by an unscrupulous Beck-endorsed dealer doesn't concern me in the least. Beck will reap his own harvest.
All the States incorporated daughter corporations for transaction of business in the 1960s or so. - Some voice in Van Pelt's head, circa 2006.
I, too, despise Glenn Beck; but that has nothing to do with the fact that I'm a liberal while he isn't. It's that he's a blowhard cheap-shot ranter who talks lowest-common-denominator politics day in and day out, and then puts on his "hey -- I'm an entertainer" hat whenever he is called to task for his excesses.
In Boston, we used to have a talk show host named david Brudnoy. He was a libertarian conservative; but he was erudite and literate, and knew how to have an intelligent conversation with people. If they held opposing viewpoints, he respected them unless they had the same mindless quality as Beck's rants (or like much of what one sees under the Comments tabs on online newspaper articles). Brudnoy did have his weaknesses; but listening to his program was still an enjoyable experience, especially with his trademark dry wit (my favorite examples are from the nights when he told his listeners that he would not be on the air, the following evening, because of "another exciting Boston Bruins hockey game" (the Bruins shares the same station, during hockey season). There was a very subtle tone and meter in Brudnoy's voice which indicated that his tongue was in his cheek as he spoke.
The current incumbent, Dan Rea, is also a conservative; but Rea will give you his respect unless your own intemperance makes him withdraw it. In the evenings, if conditions are right, much of the country can hear him at 1030 kHz from 8 to midnight on weeknights.
"We've been attacked by the intelligent, educated segment of the culture." -- Pastor Ray Mummert, Dover, PA, during an attempt to introduce creationism -- er, "intelligent design", into the Dover Public Schools
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