John Joe Gray: Militia Nut

[Prof]

Neither the Judge nor I have updated the current status of this successful attempt to become a free man, standing on the land. John Joe gray has succeeded in seceeding:

http://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas ... 693380.php

How's that working out for JJG?

[Judge Roy Bean]

He and his family are not unique and it isn't just Texas phenomenon.

Living off the land and out of the mainstream seems so foreign to so many people that anyone who does it appears to be a nut-case like Gray.

Trust me, there are people who simply don't care what national, state or local authorities have to say because they have no interface with of them. Alaska has untold numbers of them.

[Doktor Avalanche]

As long as he's not bothering anybody, making bombs or engaging in any other sort of terroristic tomfoolery he can live out in the middle of nowhere off the grid all he wants.

[Demosthenes]

He and his family are not unique and it isn't just Texas phenomenon.

Living off the land and out of the mainstream seems so foreign to so many people that anyone who does it appears to be a nut-case like Gray.

Trust me, there are people who simply don't care what national, state or local authorities have to say because they have no interface with of them. Alaska has untold numbers of them.

I don't know that you can legally live 100% off the grid anywhere other than in Alaska, as long there are property taxes required.

[Prof]

And, there is a father who has not been allowed to see his kids for a decade.

[Lambkin]

Even Alaskans benefit from international borders maintained at taxpayer expense. Texans, even more so. (Especially when the feds arm Mexican criminals.) And most Alaskans are on the oil "dole" anyway. There is no escape from responsibility in this life.

[Unidyne]

Reminds me of the George Carlin news reporter routine: "A man has barricaded himself inside his house; however, he is not armed and no one is paying any attention."

[pigpot]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Joe_Gray

Just asking!

[noblepa]

Found a couple of references:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/weird-news ... ed-4778319

This one seems to be from 15 years ago:

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=132697&page=1

Here's one from 2010

http://www.truecrimereport.com/2010/06/ ... he_day.php

Basically, the guy got stopped for speeding in 1999. The cop saw lots of rifles in the vehicle. Gray bit the office and tried to take his gun. Gray was arrested and released on bail. He never showed up for his trial, remaining on his farm with not electricity or running water and his family.

He has threatened to kill any LEO who enters his property. He hasn't been off his farm since 2000, so he's already served longer incarceration (self imposed) than he would have for the original charges.

The local LEO's are wary of starting another Waco-like battle, so they're just sitting tight and waiting for him to leave the property, which he shows no sign of doing.

The saddest part is that he has a 13 year old daughter who has never left the farm. She was born there.

Gray spouts a lot of the typical sovereign citizen nonsense.

[JamesVincent]

Wow. Just...wow. Only good thing I can say is he is actually being what all the other Sovs claim to be: completely self-sufficient. Makes Clive look like a piker.

Mods: can we change the heading so his name is more searchable?

[Lambkin]

He's old news on Quatloos

http://quatloos.com/Q-Forum/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=7680

[fortinbras]

This guy is still holed up with his family. There was an article on him in the London Daily Mirror, 9 Dec 2014, because a British documentary film about this, "America's Fugitive Family", aired on UK television that day. Also an article in the NY Times, 27 Oct 2014, which drew parallels between Gray and the Ruby Ridge standoff.

Evidently the first event was the divorce and child custody fight involving one of Gray's daughters and Keith Tarkington, who still lives in nearby Gun Barrel City. The court awarded custody of the two boys to Mr. Tarkington, circa 1998, but Gray's daughter took the kids into the family compound and they haven't left. Then on Christmas Eve 1999, a car in which John Joe Gray was a passenger was stopped by local police for speeding. It was discovered that Gray had a loaded handgun in a shoulder holster, for which he had no permit. A scuffle ensured when he was told to exit the car; reportedly he bit one policeman's hand and tried to grab the other policeman's gun. Given a low bail he went back to his 47-acre farm -- and then dared the authorities to come for him. There are believed to be at least 10 other people, mostly his children and grandchildren, on the farm with him. The local police have given up surveillance. I gather than the local police dept is very small and on a small budget; probably there are as many people living on the Gray farm as there are in Trinidad, the nearest town. Apart from Tarkington, hardly anybody cares about the Grays -- their troublemaking is effectively contained, and it seems they are punishing themselves worse than the local sheriff could.

One disturbing image from the British documentary is that at least one of the grandchildren was beaten for making mistakes in his homeschool arithmetic work.

[wserra]

Threads merged.

[Rakked]

This is the website of the "Embassy of Heaven," a Christian group that John Joe Gray is or was associated with. The website is full of "alternative medicine" and similar nonsense, my favorite bit of which is a tortured and nonsensical attempt to circumvent Paul's unequivocal instructions to Christians that they be good citizens and pay their taxes and such. That's neither here nor there, though; I may be interested in the loon theology, y'all are going to be more interested in the loon political ideas.

...Which are disappointingly standard "I'm under God's authority not secular authority" notions. Notable: "Jesus didn't bring us a RELIGION. He brought us a NATIONALITY."

Also, your social security card and driver's license are the Mark of the Beast, as this lovely illustration helpfully... illustrates:



Fortunately, Pastor Paul Revere (*snrk*) can tell us how to prepare "Rescission Documents" to get out of this horror and "back to the original Founding Fathers and all the stuff they were doing back then." Again, standard use of old dictionaries to think up nonsense definitions for words like "rescind" and "license." I'm not going to listen to the whole thing, as interesting as I'm sure it is; I have actual law to study and finals coming up.

The site doesn't appear to have been updated significantly for over a decade, but its collection of articles on John Joe Gray has some informative bits which are no longer available on the news outlet websites they were originally posted at.

Racheal Gray Dempsey, apparently another of JJG's daughters, got tossed in the slammer in 1998 for having "Kingdom of Heaven" license plates and driver's license instead of, y'know, Texas plates and license. The misdemeanor charges were dropped, and she predictably skipped out on the more serious charges brought. This was around the time JJG sequestered himself and his family.

In a surprising bit of forthrightness, the Embassy of Heaven included in its archive an article discussing the fact that JJG is keeping his grandkids away from their dad.

[bmxninja357]

i have no idea how he does not appear on the board. well here is a random article and i will let you dig around for the rest. its interesting...

John Joe Gray (born 1950) claims to be a sovereign and was a fugitive from the law, who currently lives on his 50-acre, wooded ranch in Trinidad, Texas. He was involved in the longest-running law enforcement standoff in American history lasting a few days short of 15 years, before the district attorney dropped the charges.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Joe_Gray

peace,
ninj

[bmxninja357]

and i see he is still at it....

TRINIDAD, Texas – Days after he discovered his 15-year standoff with sheriff's deputies was over, John Joe Gray said he now worries he could face a second stalemate with law enforcement.

"The sheriff did warn me if we couldn't start meeting our taxes, he'd have to do something we both might regret. There will be a standoff," Gray, 66, told the Star-Telegram.

He owes $34,618.98 in property taxes which haven't been paid since 2004, according to Henderson County Tax Assessor/Collector Peggy Goodall.

read it: http://www.wfaa.com/story/news/local/20 ... /78894652/

peace,
ninj

[The Observer]

http://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas ... to-1217777

http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/john-jo ... 3d71Hjem_s

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/08/us/le ... t-end.html

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nat ... 53873496/1

[Judge Roy Bean]

Folks, out here in fly-over country, there are real-live people who have little or no use for, nor contact with, the "authorities."

Believe it or not, if you really don't care and you have the means or wherewithal, you can basically go off into the fringe so far that nobody gives a damn.

[bmxninja357]

my, my , my...

i hate to have to point this out but its a sovcit win. charges dropped. no guns seized. no jail time. it was a hard go but he won...

ninj

[eric]

my, my , my...
i hate to have to point this out but its a sovcit win. charges dropped. no guns seized. no jail time. it was a hard go but he won...
ninj

From a technical point of view I would agree with you. So, next time I get into a tussle with a cop at a traffic stop that:
a. has no other witnesses;
b. even if I was found guilty might only get me a few months,
I will go hide out in the bush for fifteen or so years, remaining otherwise law abiding - I must remember this tactic. Charges were probably dropped as "no reasonable prospect of conviction" as continuing with prosecution would not serve the public interest. Sometimes, it's just not worth it, the only real victim was the original officer's dignity.
http://www.ppsc-sppc.gc.ca/eng/pub/fpsd ... /ch03.html