I quit

[Lambkin]

I quit my job today. What a relief! Sadly it's not permanent, I will have to keep working. Starting at box.net in a few weeks.

[webhick]

I quit my job today. What a relief! Sadly it's not permanent, I will have to keep working. Starting at box.net in a few weeks.

I guess it must have been pretty bad. Hopefully the job at box.net will be more enjoyable.

[Lambkin]

Well I wouldn't want to overstate my case. I'm unsatisfied and a bit overworked. I'm a computer guy in Silicon Valley. It's a red hot job market here, for what I do, so there's no reason to tolerate even a moderately crappy job. LinkedIn delivers several solicitations from recruiters every week. I did five interviews and got five offers.

[AndyK]

Well I wouldn't want to overstate my case. I'm unsatisfied and a bit overworked. I'm a computer guy in Silicon Valley. It's a red hot job market here, for what I do, so there's no reason to tolerate even a moderately crappy job. LinkedIn delivers several solicitations from recruiters every week. I did five interviews and got five offers.

This really needs to get cross-posted into the couple of whine-in threads.

HEY 99%ers: Read this. This is what really represents a majority of the non-rich.

This is a person who has learned a skill (and not investment banking), has located himself wherre there's a demand for thone skills, and has proven himself as a desirable worker.

Sitting in on one of the 'occupy' locations isn't gonna accomplish tjhat for any or you.

We owe you nothing. Get up and TCB for yourself.

[Burzmali]

Well I wouldn't want to overstate my case. I'm unsatisfied and a bit overworked. I'm a computer guy in Silicon Valley. It's a red hot job market here, for what I do, so there's no reason to tolerate even a moderately crappy job. LinkedIn delivers several solicitations from recruiters every week. I did five interviews and got five offers.

This really needs to get cross-posted into the couple of whine-in threads.

HEY 99%ers: Read this. This is what really represents a majority of the non-rich.

This is a person who has learned a skill (and not investment banking), has located himself wherre there's a demand for thone skills, and has proven himself as a desirable worker.

Sitting in on one of the 'occupy' locations isn't gonna accomplish tjhat for any or you.

We owe you nothing. Get up and TCB for yourself.

Yeah, I'm sure Lambkin acquired the knowledge and years of experience that make him a sought after employee over the weekend, didn't have a friend or family member get him his first job in the industry, and isn't in possession of an inherit talent with computers that is found in only a small fraction of the population. Surely if all the 50 year-old unemployed lathe operators just applied to Google the economy would right itself overnight.

[Brandybuck]

This rSitting in on one of the 'occupy' locations isn't gonna accomplish tjhat for any or you.

OWS Protester: "I haven't had a job offer in two months!!! Pruf that it's all rigged against me!"

[Lambkin]

I do feel fortunate to have chosen to work in an industry that so far has survived gobalization, and doesn't severely penalize my lack of education. It's not all luck since I was aware even 20 years ago that manufacturing was a dead end, so I would never have chosen to be a lathe operator. Being extremely debt and risk averse is also important, since a high income is not proof against financial misery. But I can't tell you the solution for people who already chose the wrong career, made bad choices about taking on debt, bought overpriced homes and cars, had kids when they weren't financially secure, etc.

[JamesVincent]

Surely if all the 50 year-old unemployed lathe operators just applied to Google the economy would right itself overnight.

Lathe operators who bother to learn CNC operating are very much in demand. They are going like hot cakes. Theres several companies I see constantly advertising in some of the skilled tradesman magazines I peruse from to time that are willing to pay competitive wages and relocation expenses for a good one with experience. Theres one company in particular outside of Knoxville,TE that advertises in the skilled trade/ craft section of Craigslist constantly for experienced machinist.

[The Observer]

Surely if all the 50 year-old unemployed lathe operators just applied to Google the economy would right itself overnight

Wow! The entire OWS movement consists of 50 year-old unemployed lathe operators. Who knew? I guess those reports, pictures and videos by the media of 20-somethings throwing rocks, taking handouts, whining on their laptop about how they can't land a job with their master's degree in marionette and puppetry, and their contributing to the sanitation and safety problems just proves that the media can't locate the real protest, huh?

[Burzmali]

Surely if all the 50 year-old unemployed lathe operators just applied to Google the economy would right itself overnight.

Lathe operators who bother to learn CNC operating are very much in demand. They are going like hot cakes. Theres several companies I see constantly advertising in some of the skilled tradesman magazines I peruse from to time that are willing to pay competitive wages and relocation expenses for a good one with experience. Theres one company in particular outside of Knoxville,TE that advertises in the skilled trade/ craft section of Craigslist constantly for experienced machinist.

I worked with around 20 lathe operators, of which 2 were setup people, trained to program the CNCs. Training operators is experience, especially with a union, and tended to make the operators think they could "fix" a problem with a complex program often resulting in a crashed head or, worse yet, a more subtle flaw that QC might not catch. Machinists are a whole 'nother category, we had 3 of those and 3 tool makers at our peak, all but one 50+, and all were able to quick find employment once we laid them off.
The biggest problem with trusting advertising in magazines is that they often forget to mention the particular brands of machine that the new hires will be expected to be able to program.

[wserra]

The entire OWS movement consists of 50 year-old unemployed lathe operators.

Nah. Then it would be called "Knurl Wall Street".

[Burzmali]

The entire OWS movement consists of 50 year-old unemployed lathe operators.

Nah. Then it would be called "Knurl Wall Street".

Have you not learned the lesson yet? If you go with a generic name like "Knurl Wall Street" half the folks are liable to show up expecting a diamond knurl and a third a straight knurl and the rest are going to be looking for a band.

[Mr. Mephistopheles]

Surely if all the 50 year-old unemployed lathe operators just applied to Google the economy would right itself overnight.

Lathe operators who bother to learn CNC operating are very much in demand. They are going like hot cakes. Theres several companies I see constantly advertising in some of the skilled tradesman magazines I peruse from to time that are willing to pay competitive wages and relocation expenses for a good one with experience. Theres one company in particular outside of Knoxville,TE that advertises in the skilled trade/ craft section of Craigslist constantly for experienced machinist.

I worked with around 20 lathe operators, of which 2 were setup people, trained to program the CNCs. Training operators is experience, especially with a union, and tended to make the operators think they could "fix" a problem with a complex program often resulting in a crashed head or, worse yet, a more subtle flaw that QC might not catch. Machinists are a whole 'nother category, we had 3 of those and 3 tool makers at our peak, all but one 50+, and all were able to quick find employment once we laid them off.
The biggest problem with trusting advertising in magazines is that they often forget to mention the particular brands of machine that the new hires will be expected to be able to program.

Damn, you beat me to it. As you note, there is a HUGE difference between machine operators and Machinists. I'm peripherally involved in the machining industry and know that machine operators are a dime a dozen, while Machinists / tool and die makers, are rare and becoming even more rare as they retire, which few filling their ranks. I think a large part of the problem is that machine operators made pretty good wages for years and thus had little incentive to increase their skills. Now, they're rattling a cup like a lot of others because someone in China can put parts in a vise and punch buttons for a lot less than in the U.S.

[Burzmali]

Damn, you beat me to it. As you note, there is a HUGE difference between machine operators and Machinists. I'm peripherally involved in the machining industry and know that machine operators are a dime a dozen, while Machinists / tool and die makers, are rare and becoming even more rare as they retire, which few filling their ranks. I think a large part of the problem is that machine operators made pretty good wages for years and thus had little incentive to increase their skills. Now, they're rattling a cup like a lot of others because someone in China can put parts in a vise and punch buttons for a lot less than in the U.S.

Even worse is that given enough time and effort, you can train someone to be a functional machinist, but no amount of training will make them a tool and die maker, that's a life long craft. The disappearance of tool and die makers is a symptom of why high-speed manufacturing is never going to flourish in the US again, regardless of margin, as we simply won't be able to build the equipment necessary to facilitate it. Well, at least not for a generation or so.

[AndyK]

Machinists, unlike machine operators, do not look for the USB port on a micrometer.

[Mr. Mephistopheles]

Damn, you beat me to it. As you note, there is a HUGE difference between machine operators and Machinists. I'm peripherally involved in the machining industry and know that machine operators are a dime a dozen, while Machinists / tool and die makers, are rare and becoming even more rare as they retire, which few filling their ranks. I think a large part of the problem is that machine operators made pretty good wages for years and thus had little incentive to increase their skills. Now, they're rattling a cup like a lot of others because someone in China can put parts in a vise and punch buttons for a lot less than in the U.S.

Even worse is that given enough time and effort, you can train someone to be a functional machinist, but no amount of training will make them a tool and die maker, that's a life long craft. The disappearance of tool and die makers is a symptom of why high-speed manufacturing is never going to flourish in the US again, regardless of margin, as we simply won't be able to build the equipment necessary to facilitate it. Well, at least not for a generation or so.

I agree that tool-making is a craft that requires special aptitude, but I'm a little confused with the first part of your reply, I don't think your implying it's impossible to train new tool and die makers. Again, I think the bulk of lack of tool and die makers/machinists is due to high wages for operators rather than a wholesale lack of aptitude. A close friend who has been a machinist for 35 started predicting this shortage about 20 years ago. Another factor is the trend in education beginning ~20 - 25 years ago when vocational programs started losing funding. This started with the idea that a person has to have college degree(s) to be labeled successful. In short, learning a trade instead of going to college carried a little stigma.

[Burzmali]

Even worse is that given enough time and effort, you can train someone to be a functional machinist, but no amount of training will make them a tool and die maker, that's a life long craft. The disappearance of tool and die makers is a symptom of why high-speed manufacturing is never going to flourish in the US again, regardless of margin, as we simply won't be able to build the equipment necessary to facilitate it. Well, at least not for a generation or so.

I agree that tool-making is a craft that requires special aptitude, but I'm a little confused with the first part of your reply, I don't think your implying it's impossible to train new tool and die makers. Again, I think the bulk of lack of tool and die makers/machinists is due to high wages for operators rather than a wholesale lack of aptitude. A close friend who has been a machinist for 35 started predicting this shortage about 20 years ago. Another factor is the trend in education beginning ~20 - 25 years ago when vocational programs started losing funding. This started with the idea that a person has to have college degree(s) to be labeled successful. In short, learning a trade instead of going to college carried a little stigma.

I was talking from the point of view of a company. If you know you have a machinist or two retiring in a few years and a few younger folks with a reasonable level of aptitude with the lathes and reasonable firm skulls, you can probably train them to replace the retirees. However, if you have a tool and die maker leaving, you call a head hunter.

[Mr. Mephistopheles]

I was talking from the point of view of a company. If you know you have a machinist or two retiring in a few years and a few younger folks with a reasonable level of aptitude with the lathes and reasonable firm skulls, you can probably train them to replace the retirees. However, if you have a tool and die maker leaving, you call a head hunter.

I agree completely, and unfortunately don't have the time to make a pun out of "skull" and "head hunter".

[Evil Squirrel Overlord]

We're currently are updating our old Manufacturing Technology degree to fill in the demand for more high-tech manufacturing technicians in demand in our area. (Nano and biotechnology.) It is a 4-year accredited degree.

[wserra]

Nuts grow on trees. You can climb trees.

What more do you need?