Conceptualizing the TP/Soverign Movement as a Religion

[LightinDarkness]

Over the past few years I've been trying to find a theory of how to explain TPs and Sovereigns. I have been an observer of the wider conspiracy theory and for lack of a better term the "tin foil hat" brigade for coming close to 10 years now. It all started for me after I joined Freemasonry and had friends of mine inform me I was now ruling the world and worshiping Lucifer because of it (ah, wouldn't that be nice - well the ruling the world part at least).

I see a difference in TPs/Sovereigns and the wider conspiracy community. TPs and Soverigns stand alone to my knowledge in being willing to actually time and again cause material financial and personal harm (ie prison time) to themselves by practicing their theories. This is say opposed to your standard anti-mason conspiracy theorist, who might spend all night on the internet decrying the new world order but otherwise lives a normal life.

So what is it that makes TPs and sovereigns different? My theory is they have become in essence a religion. I come to that conclusion after trying out other models of their behavior that just don't work. They aren't practicing a philosophy or political viewpoint because to do that you still have to accept reality (IE you may believe you shouldn't be passed, but if your TP view points were philosophical only you would still pay taxes). And, what to me is most amazing, is that NO AMOUNT OF OBJECTIVE OBVIOUS EXAMPLES OF their theories losing in court is enough to persuade them that perhaps its all a bunch of made up BS. You have people throwing away their lives, their homes, their wealth for this stuff - even though since these movements began in the 1970s there has not been one objective "win" where one single TP or Sovereign theory has stood up in court. To me, that it is simply extraordinary that people would throw away their lives for something with 0 proof and countless examples of failure. So there must be something which keeps them believing in the face of reality.

So I give to you the Religion of Tax Protestors and Sovereign Citizens, for your consideration:

Who is the Deity or chief source of goodness in this religion?
Remedy. For people who believe in this stuff, they all claim they want Remedy. Believers do everything - and sacrifice everything - for Remedy. And when it doesn't work, its not that Remedy doesn't exist, its that they did the legal ritual (more on that later) wrong. Remedy can be all things to all believers. It is the answer to getting out of your debts. It lets you get out of your mortgage. It causes judges and attorneys to flee before your vast legal power and authority.

What are the sacred texts of this religion?
It depends on the sect but they all seem to have them - Cracking the Code for Tax Protestors, Credit River and Black's Law Dictionary for Sovereign Citizens, etc. These sources are held to be absolutely infallible and divinely inspired. Anything which points to them being wrong is itself wrong. They cannot be questioned.

What are the rituals of this religion?
Most religions are in part defined by their rituals, and the TP and Sovereign religion is no different. There are two types of rituals: individual rituals and group rituals.

Individual Rituals: The rituals for the TP are the filing of their returns in whatever manner their prescribed holy text recommends. The rituals for the sovereign are the writing and filing of their paperwork terrorism documents.

Group Rituals: This is the mythical legal dance in the court room. Not passing the bar, refusing to answer to your name, saying you don't understand, making the judge give their oaths, etc. When done right, these rituals bring the TP or Sovereign closer to Remedy.

What is the hierarchy of the religion?
There seem to be four types of people in this religion:
(1) The Believers - This is your typical sovereign or tax protestor. They've filed their sovereign paperwork/incorrect tax return. They listen to the podcasts and conference calls. These are the lay people of the religion.
(2) The Priests - This is the next step up. They are the leaders of the conference calls, the moderators of the religions message boards. They are how the Believers get access to the Prophets (see below).
(3) The Prophets - These are the TP and Sovereign gurus who are the founts of sacred knowledge. Tim Turner, Peter Schiff, etc. They have in some cases written the Sacred Texts, and they are the closest to Remedy.
(4) The Saints and Martyrs - These are those divine few (usually former Believers) who have gone all the way and been sent to prison or lost everything in their search for Remedy. They are revered as examples for all to follow, and would have succeeded in finding Remedy - of course - if it were not for the corrupt judge/accidentally granting jurisdiction/otherwise not performing their legal ritual correctly, etc.

NOTE: I realize I am lumping TPs and Sovereigns, and they are different, but for purposes of the religion framework I believe they operate the same way (its just the details are different).

Thoughts?

[wserra]

I was now ruling the world and worshiping Lucifer because of it (ah, wouldn't that be nice - well the ruling the world part at least).

Sorry. You wanna rule the world, you gotta worship the Devil. Got to pay your dues if you want to sing the blues, and you know it don't come easy.

We've been calling it a cult for years, for all the reasons you articulately express.

[fortinbras]

"sov'runs" seem to adhere to their pseudolegal beliefs much as if they were religious tenets - in the sense that their adherence to the notion is unshaken by experiencing failure nor by any logical argument.

They do have certain ceremonial aspects. Among other bits of looniness, sov'runs have refused to step into the cockpit of the court, insisting on remaining behind the railing even when the judge makes clear that they will not be allowed to participate that way or even if the judge will treat them as failing to appear in court. Some evidently seem obsessed with the courtroom flag (the gold edging, a feature of indoor flags, is alleged to mean that the court is military/admiralty or something other than kosher). Some bring their own flags into court, somehow believing that being in contact or proximity with their own flag (not necessary the US flag; the McLarens attended court with the Republic of Texas flag) somehow gives them sanctuary from the court. There are some other odd rituals.

And some graft their craziness onto religion; somehow their religion makes them exempt from paying taxes, getting a license as a prerequisite for driving, etc. Sometimes they claim to have gotten this dispensation from reading the Bible, sometimes they claim a more unique form of revelation, and more than a few have either created or latched onto ad hoc churches that claim nonpayment of taxes as an article of faith.

[Kestrel]

Not long ago a would-be sov'run mis-quoted for me (out of context, of course) the line in the Declaration of Independence which says, "governments... deriv[e] their just powers from the consent of the governed."

Since he declared that he didn't consent to the current government, he tried to tell me that whatever laws they passed didn't apply to him.

I told him he was full of s**t. If "consent of the governed" enables you to pick and choose which laws apply to you, then no criminal arrested anywhere could ever be convicted of any crime. Armed robbers, rapists, murderers and car thieves certainly don't consent to the laws they violate, but they get to go to prison anyway.

There was an election, his candidates lost, tough. Better luck next time. When his candidates won and then passed laws he didn't like, tough again. By his actions he implicitly consented to the current government and the process for selecting public officials. He chose to stay in his comfortable American home in a comfortable American neighborhood, enjoying the comfort of American governmental services funded by federal, state and local tax dollars protecting him from armed robbers, rapists, murderers and car thieves.

If he really wants to be governed by some other set of laws, there are plenty of other countries to pick from, and he could certainly get enough money to buy a bus ticket by pawning something. Uninhabited islands with fresh running water and no established government are in pretty short supply nowadays.

The would-be sov'run took his rationalizations elsewhere.

[Number Six]

"If he really wants to be governed by some other set of laws, there are plenty of other countries to pick from, and he could certainly get enough money to buy a bus ticket by pawning something. Uninhabited islands with fresh running water and no established government are in pretty short supply nowadays."

Actually you have to have quite a bit of money to be granted residency privileges in most countries. Canada? No dice. South America? If you have bucks in significant quantity. European countries? Once again, you may be able to marry into citizenship but that is a long and involved process. Since my grandfather was from England I understand there would be some sort of right of return after proof and a lot of paperwork. Lawless sovereigns who have made life difficult for the courts and their fellow citizens need to get with the program and back to work. I guess they just enjoy being social pests and menaces.

[Kestrel]

Actually you have to have quite a bit of money to be granted residency privileges in most countries. Canada? No dice. South America? If you have bucks in significant quantity. European countries? Once again, you may be able to marry into citizenship but that is a long and involved process. Since my grandfather was from England I understand there would be some sort of right of return after proof and a lot of paperwork.

Depends on the country. Any former American wanting to emigrate to the Soviet Union or East Germany would have been welcomed with open arms. You'll probably still find a hearty welcome in North Korea. Although... a typical formerly American sov'run is not likely to be happy with the type of government already established there.

Lawless sovereigns who have made life difficult for the courts and their fellow citizens need to get with the program and back to work. I guess they just enjoy being social pests and menaces.

Makes me wish for the colonial days, when people who objected to their government could be forcibly shipped off to Australia or some ungoverned territory in the American west. We'd all be happier if we could forcibly ship sov'runs off to anyplace outside of a national park where the population is less than 5 people per 100 square miles. Maybe someplace in the Afghan mountains, or the Amazon jungle, or Siberia, or the deserts of the American southwest.

[The Observer]

Makes me wish for the colonial days, when people who objected to their government could be forcibly shipped off to Australia or some ungoverned territory in the American west.

Yes, the euphemism used was, I believe, "transportation", being a mite-sounding better than "forcible exile". Which has long been a tool of governments getting rid of their unwanted troublesome citizens. Ancient Greece and Rome pursued such a policy and it was seen in some circles as a penalty worse than death (being one of the reasons that Socrates decided on taking hemlock rather than escaping as urged by some of his adherents). Long before Lenin and Stalin began shipping dissidents and political "criminals" to gulags, the czars were shipping their opponents to Siberia under sentence of exile.

Exile in time, I think, tends to create martyrs and romantic stoic figures and lends credence to the opponent; I don't think that it would be a stretch to see an exiled TP raised on a pedestal over the years by those who never really knew him or her. I think we need to go back to the age of outlaws and let sovruns face the short and brutish life under natural law.

[LPC]

Who is the Deity or chief source of goodness in this religion?
Remedy.

I don't think that tax deniers (or sovereigns) worship any particular thing (or even any particular idea).

I think that they are all dominated by the Matrix-like thought that "it's not supposed to be this way."

The best allegory I can think of is not religion, but gender identity disorder.

[webhick]

The best allegory I can think of is not religion, but gender identity disorder.

So you're saying the best solution is a) neuter them and make them grow boobs or b) attach a winkie and put hair on their chest.

I can't say I disagree.

[fortinbras]

I wouldn't liken it to gender identity disorder. That sort of disorder is related to feelings of love and warmth, while the Sov'runs seem to be more concerned with whom to hate and fight.

[Gregg]

"If he really wants to be governed by some other set of laws, there are plenty of other countries to pick from, and he could certainly get enough money to buy a bus ticket by pawning something. Uninhabited islands with fresh running water and no established government are in pretty short supply nowadays."

Actually you have to have quite a bit of money to be granted residency privileges in most countries. Canada? No dice. South America? If you have bucks in significant quantity. European countries? Once again, you may be able to marry into citizenship but that is a long and involved process. Since my grandfather was from England I understand there would be some sort of right of return after proof and a lot of paperwork. Lawless sovereigns who have made life difficult for the courts and their fellow citizens need to get with the program and back to work. I guess they just enjoy being social pests and menaces.

On the other hand, I hear Somalia has very lax immigration controls. But I'm not sure there is a US Embassy there for you to present yourself at to legally renounce your citizenship.

[Number Six]

If you look at the history of Europe and emigration to America, there were many reasons people left their home countries, some for economic opportunity others to avoid religious persecution. Waves of immigrants to the U.S. each brought their religious beliefs and cultural values along. In terms of how the law has evolved to try to maintain order in this country, the winners have been those who knew how to use their resources to maintain and increase their advantages, the losers have been those who have fought the system in unproductive ways. The nonsense about telling various protestors either on the political left or right they need to go to a country more in line with their beliefs is just stupid. Try to reason with people and show respect for them and you might have a chance in getting them to do the right thing.

What did Henry Thoreau say? "There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the root." Also he said this: "I have yet to hear the first syllable of valuable or even earnest advice from my seniors." Somewhat arrogant, but not far from the truth.

[Cathulhu]

What did Henry Thoreau say? "There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the root." Also he said this: "I have yet to hear the first syllable of valuable or even earnest advice from my seniors." Somewhat arrogant, but not far from the truth.

Speak for your own seniors. When dealing with idiots, e.g. "what if I call it lawful money?" I like to quote my own granpa: "Kid, you can call that chicken a duck, but it'll still sink when it hits the water." Anyone who can raise ten kids has to have some smarts.

[Unidyne]

Being that it has its zealots, fanatics, and people in its ranks accusing each other of heresy, I guess you could call it a religion.

[LightinDarkness]

Who is the Deity or chief source of goodness in this religion?
Remedy.

I don't think that tax deniers (or sovereigns) worship any particular thing (or even any particular idea).

I think that they are all dominated by the Matrix-like thought that "it's not supposed to be this way."

The best allegory I can think of is not religion, but gender identity disorder.

One of the most widely accepted scholarly definitions of religion is: a system of symbols that establishes powerful, pervasive, and long-lasting moods and motivations people by creating conceptions of a general order of existence and giving these conceptions the such a concrete illusion of being true in fact that the moods and motivations seem part of the world's real general order.

I'm going to go through the list for sovereigns -

- A system of symbols? Check - sovereign mythology has lots of symbolic items. The court room furniture, red ink, bloody thumb prints, the color of the paper they use, the seemingly supernatural power of certain words, etc.
- Established a powerful, pervasive, and long-lasting motivation that appears to be founded in the real world. Check - how else can you explain people who in the face of a 100% loss rate literally throw away absolute everything? Because their system of symbols motivates them to believe that they have power over the general order of things in the world.

It is in every sense a religion, particularly sovereigns, although the case is probably less for TPs but I think there is still one to make.

[LightinDarkness]

Also, depending on the flavor of lunacy were talking about, suggesting a sovereign or TP go to a different country is actually quite appropriate. Most sovereigns I know believe the courts are harboring a massive conspiracy against them. They don't believe the system can change without - they believe their sovereign view of the world already exists, its just hidden by a massive conspiracy. Were they simply a brand of libertarian lunacy stating they wanted to convert society into a "do no harm" "common law" (I use "Common law" in quotes because this isn't really what common law means we all know, its just their definition of it) court system, then they could attempt to do so the right way by voting and electing their fellow kooks into office.

But they don't do that. Most won't even vote because they claim doing so puts you under the governments jurisdiction. So for them the proper thing to do is indeed to go to a largely lawless state like Somalia where they can live out their dream. Although we all know once they get there they will find its not quite as fun as they thought it would be.

[The Observer]

Peter Schiff, son of infamous TP Irwin Schiff, appeared on CNBC to voice his opinion on the "fiscal cliff" issue.

Normally, this wouldn't rate to be mentioned on Quatloos, except for the comment that Peter makes: "I don't care what the majority voted to do, they don't have a right to steal my money just because they vote for it." I think that comment shows the underlying thinking of many TPs and sovruns who view taxation as theft. There is a strong disconnect between their payment of taxes and receiving benefits from that taxation. And apparently the disconnect is strong that they begin to act on their belief rather stop and get the entire view of the picture.

I'm not saying that Peter Schiff is a TP just because of that statment or because of his relationship to his father. However, I am sure that Irwin got his start into the koolade barrel because he just didn't like the thought of his money being given over to someone else - a view that possibly he shares with his son.

[AndyK]

Peter a TP / evader / enabler

Where do you think all of Daddy's guru dollars went?

The wheels may turn slowly, but other people are following the trail.

[Doktor Avalanche]

Ah, Sovruntopia...

Yes, in Sovruntopia we'd have rampant quackery, organ-seizure, baby-selling, slavery in all but name - BUT THAT'S FREEDOM, BABY!

[fortinbras]

[Moderator: The Observer] Post was deleted due to the poster making a political commentary regarding the Tea Party movement. This is in conflict with the current policy that religion and politics will not be discussed on the site here. Please ensure that your future posts are on point with regards to sovereign movements and tax defiers/posters by not linking them with other political or religious issues.