Temporary Guardianship

[webhick]

My niece is coming to live with me and I've got to draft a letter authorizing me and my mother to be her guardian until my sister and brother-in-law find a place to live. I've looked online and it's a little confusing. A lot of the sites are conflicting about what's allowable and what's not and they differ from each other greatly. Some even saying that a notarized letter, no matter the content, means nothing.

I'm not sure if school wording is going to be an issue because she's 3, but I may end up losing touch with the parents by the time she needs to enroll. My sister is under the delusion that it won't even take a year for them to get on their feet, but I'm not that hopeful.

And there's other factors. Like how my niece doesn't have any kind of health insurance. My sister said she's going to try to re-apply for medicaid for her but I'm not sure how that would work since the kid doesn't live with her anymore.

Anyone got a good resource for this? I'm in NH and the best 211's got to offer is legal aid, and they just told me to look on the internet.

[wserra]

webhick - see your PMs.

[Parvati]

As has been said before, have a peek at your in-box for the nitty-gritty.

re: Guardianship -- It's not exactly like having parental rights, and every state seems to regard it differently. Where my cousin lives, there's the expectation that a Guardian would (and I'm paraphrasing what I recall to be the law, here) act in accordance with what they believe the parent's wishes would be, if said individual was there to make the decision. Guardianship only gives you the power to act for the parent, and only in a way you believe they would want you to act. (For example, my aunt was unable to get one of the girls the Gardasil vaccine--the doctor said it required parental consent--guardianship didn't cut it.) Whether this was a legal mistake on the doc's part or not, I can't say, but I have seen some odd, odd things pop up regarding Guardian status.

re: Medicaid -- Since she's over 1, your niece has been booted off her mother's Medicaid already. But hey, if her parents are eligible for Medicaid, she's almost certainly eligible for CHIP. I'd apply now--it takes AGES to process. A. G. E. S. Seriously. The only reason my cousin's youngest kids were processed more quickly is that their eligibility is validated by that of their siblings, who are already in the system.

I'd hash everything out in writing, and find a darn good lawyer to boot.

[webhick]

We used to have a program up here called Healthy Kids which would provide health insurance to only the kids in a household. Parts of it were removed and other parts rolled into Medicaid. I just ran through the eligibility test and it's looking promising. But it talks about households, and she's not in theirs anymore. So I think my sister is SOL. On the other hand, once I can get my tax return I can likely go for temporary guardianship and apply. I doubt the parents would object since I'm going to be very clear in the documentation that it's only until they secure permanent housing.

Thank you very much guys, this has been a huge help.

[Judge Roy Bean]

... I doubt the parents would object since I'm going to be very clear in the documentation that it's only until they secure permanent housing.

Thank you very much guys, this has been a huge help.

I would suggest you map out the plan in advance for what will happen if they are unable to acquire "permanent housing," and as you might have found, in some states even a notarized letter from the parent(s) is suspect.

Family courts can have broad discretion, so much so that the parties can become polarized to the degree that any number of unanticipated and even dangerously confrontational situations crop up.

[webhick]

Well, I warned them yesterday that a notarized letter likely wouldn't mean anything and that we would likely need through the state for it to be legal. I made it clear that we'd only be seeking temporary guardianship and my sister was okay with it. I've got to come up with wording tonight that we can all sign off on tomorrow so we can all be on the same page when I file the petition/motion/whatever. I figure it also might count for me at the hearing if they do an about-face and claim that they never agreed to something like that.

I'm afraid that they're going to try to secure a family room at the shelter and try to take her back. I'm pretty certain we can talk them out of such stupid selfishness by pointing out how emotionally damaging that kind of bouncing around can be and that those rooms need to be saved for families who have no safe place to put their kids. If they insist, I don't think I have a right to stop them at this juncture and then I will file for temporary guardianship whether they like it or not.

I know I need to look up what the courts define permanent residence as. I also want them to prove they have a steady source of income, have been at the place three months or longer and are not behind on the rent. This is the second time they've been evicted since August and they'd been behind at the last place since they moved in.

I'm assuming you're talking about permanent guardianship being the end-game should they not find a place to live. I get that, since the longer this goes on, the more likely we are to hit a point of no return where it would be more emotionally damaging for her to be uprooted from us and placed back with them than it would for them to just have visitations. They're already really upset and my mother had to keep assuring them that it was only temporary so any mention of permanent may result in a problem. Joe has been in jail numerous time, at least once for a violent offense and he has a an alcohol problem so any confrontation could potentially be dangerous.

These kinds of things can quickly go sideways, I'm aware of that. I also know that government interference can make things a lot worse. If it goes permanent, whether they agreed to it or it, they're going to blame us for everything that went wrong in their lives since the moment my niece moved in with us. I don't think the government is going to deny us temporary guardianship. We can provide a much more stable home life, have no criminal history and have jobs.

[ashlynne39]

webhick - see your PMs.

I do guardianship work for the state of texas. I'm sure it is somewhat different but I will be happy to look up new hampshire regulations and give you my thoughts. I will pm you when I get home tonight.

[webhick]

Thank you very much.

[JamesVincent]

Out of curiosity Web how is this going? I must say Im glad to see that you are helping as much as you can for the child, they are what it's about.

[webhick]

Everything went kind of sideways on Sunday. My sister was okay with everything but the father launched into a paranoid diatribe wherein he accused us of stealing his daughter, using her to get child support (when the paperwork said we weren't seeking child support), using her to get on every government service available (we only needed medical for her), making all his decisions for him, ruining her by not letting her watch TV all day (it sounds like I'm exaggerating, but they really did run their TVs 24/7), trying to take her away forever AND that we were going to give him back a different kid. Epic eye roll. Of course, you have to pepper in his trademark "poor me" bullshit, which started early when she first sat on his lap, gave him a big hug and he asked her "How does it feel to have a loser for a daddy?" He also used his usual go-tos like "They'd be better off without me," "Daddy's going to hang himself" and "If you could take (the mother) too, I could be free and live on the streets with my friends." All this in front of his daughter.

It took less than 30 minutes for me to want to throttle him so bad I was actually close to doing it. Instead, I walked out. My mother stayed behind to try to talk some sense into him but it didn't work very well. He only stayed another half an hour and didn't even say good-bye to his kid when he left.

I've personally had it with him. I've never been his fan, but I tried to support the both of them and now that I know what he's really like I want him out of their lives. He's damaging my sister emotionally and scarring my niece and no one deserves that.

My sister grew a pair yesterday and told him that he needs to get counseling and get a job. He's got thirty days to do it or she's leaving him. If that happens, my sister and my niece will live with us. Unfortunately, my niece is going back to live with her mother and father at their temporary residence tomorrow. Her stuff is going to stay at mine. The temporary residence is at a friend's house. The friend just lost her husband and it's at least a steady place to stay (and my niece is friends with the kids there). On the other hand, my sister and her husband aren't supposed to be on the property...so...yeah. If they get booted from there, I'll take in my sister and niece and we'll make it work.

[Prof]

If I can be of assistance, ask. Otherwise, best wishes; I am tremendously impressed with your willingness to get involved and put up with this sort of stress.

[webhick]

Honestly, I don't think any of you guys could have walked away either.

[JamesVincent]

Web, it's one of those things you don't know about or think about until it happens. When I took my kids I had a lot of people say how impressed they were that I did. I told them I don't any other way to be other then a father and caretaker for them. Wouldn't have crossed my mind to be any other thing. You have the same personality traits with the need to help and on top of that you're a woman so it's even stronger in you. But there are a lot of people who wouldn't do what you did, even for their own kids. Again, I commend you for doing what you're doing. I don't know if I could be of help but you only have to ask if you think I can.

[webhick]

Well it ended up that I filed a complaint with DCYF. Heard back today. Not good news. They will not even be conducting an interview, much less think about removing the child. Apparently the rule is that she has a roof over her head, it's okay. The second she's literally on the street, they can do something.

I told them about the drinking, having homeless people sleep on their couch, my sister's histrionics, the feeding issue and they're saying it's not even enough to conduct an interview.

Because my sister and her husband are still together, my mother can't even petition for Grandparent's rights.

My sister flew off the handle for no good reason twice this weekend and told me that everything I ever said and did hurts her and I've been doing it for her whole life (she's six years old). She insinuated that I'm verbally abusive and should not be allowed any contact with her daughter. She also tried to impose rules on us in our own home. Like not being allowed to talk unless she's in the room and can hear us. Or that I will not be allowed any quiet time (this is actually the term we used with her when she wouldn't stop talking through every TV show we were trying to watch) anymore or be left alone (this was how we described my need to not be disturbed constantly when I'm trying to work). I would also not be allowed to speak about Pearl or her or Joe at all.

Stephanie is dead to me. My mother is still on decent terms with her and is going to try to keep an eye on Pearl.

[The Observer]

Sorry to hear that your sister has become a major obstacle to her daughter's well-being and is blaming you for the situation. This is unfortunately what happens when a person does not want to take responsibility for their situation and does not want things to change. It is not surprising that she retreated from the solution that you and your mother were providing. But it is also sad that she doesn't love her child enough to do the right thing, no matter how hard it may seem to her.

Keep the lines of communication open somehow, in case the opportunity arises that allows you guys to intervene on the child's behalf.

[JamesVincent]

That is very surprising to hear. CPS did a full investigation on me right before Christmas (as a matter of fact, came to my house while I was in Ky for Thanksgiving) because someone claimed I wasn't feeding the children correctly and that they were dirty. They interviewed the kids at school and me at home and dropped it immediately. Maybe talk to a mental health professional about intervening on your behalf, they may pay more attention to them then you. As sad as it is to say, if you cannot get help with the situation with them having a roof, take the roof away. Someone needs to step in if this child is going to have a normal, healthy life and it sounds like you and your mother are only ones trying.

[ashlynne39]

Well it ended up that I filed a complaint with DCYF. Heard back today. Not good news. They will not even be conducting an interview, much less think about removing the child. Apparently the rule is that she has a roof over her head, it's okay. The second she's literally on the street, they can do something.

I told them about the drinking, having homeless people sleep on their couch, my sister's histrionics, the feeding issue and they're saying it's not even enough to conduct an interview.

Because my sister and her husband are still together, my mother can't even petition for Grandparent's rights.

My sister flew off the handle for no good reason twice this weekend and told me that everything I ever said and did hurts her and I've been doing it for her whole life (she's six years old). She insinuated that I'm verbally abusive and should not be allowed any contact with her daughter. She also tried to impose rules on us in our own home. Like not being allowed to talk unless she's in the room and can hear us. Or that I will not be allowed any quiet time (this is actually the term we used with her when she wouldn't stop talking through every TV show we were trying to watch) anymore or be left alone (this was how we described my need to not be disturbed constantly when I'm trying to work). I would also not be allowed to speak about Pearl or her or Joe at all.

Stephanie is dead to me. My mother is still on decent terms with her and is going to try to keep an eye on Pearl.

Well that is utter B S. If a roof over the head was sufficient then cps wouldn't investigate abuse cases as long as the child had a home when the abuse was happening. Did you talk to a lawyer up in your area. I would think that an attorney who works in the courts that handle guardianship would be your best bet because they will have ties to the court and most likely have the courts ear. Here in Texas there is a provision in statute where you can bypass APS and file a report of abuse or neglect directly with the courts. I've never looked to see if there is a similar statute to bypass CPS but it would be handy for you if there was some sort of statute like that where you are. In any case I'm surprised about the response you got from CPS and my best suggestion is to talk to an attorney who regularly practices in this field s they may have contacts in CPS and the court to get this moving. I'm going to do some research on this. Granted my experience is in Texas but my experience with CPS or APS leads me to believe you are just getting the run around.

[webhick]

Well that is utter B S. If a roof over the head was sufficient then cps wouldn't investigate abuse cases as long as the child had a home when the abuse was happening.

I think the implication is that you can bounce your kid from house to house for as long as you want without any repercussions from CPS.

Even with the neglect allegations added to that, it still wasn't enough for them to conduct an interview. Pearl likely hasn't been abused in any overt way (sexual or physical) and while my sister under-feeds her, Pearl is at a decent weight (Steph has a habit of loading her up on juice and milk).

Did you talk to a lawyer up in your area.

I don't have the money for a lawyer, so I called legal aid. She was very flippant and said that the only thing I could do was call DCYF.

Looking back at a calendar, it seems my sister is beginning to show a pattern. Five days after Pearl went to live with her at Karen's, she just had to "get out of here." Five days after we stopped practically raising her child for her while they were with us, she just had to "get out of here." Five days to the day after moving in with Donna, she's now moved back in with Karen. Tuesday marks the next five day period. Donna's husband wants nothing to do with her, so the only other option for her is back with us.

This time, the only one who can move in is Pearl. If that happens we'll fill for Temporary Guardianship. If it doesn't and Pearl no longer has a roof over her head, then I can call DCYF again. My sister is not allowed back in our home. Earlier today, my mother noticed that the cap on one of her bottles of expired Vicodin was not closed properly. My mom had a nasty chronic tooth infection that was finally at a point where it could be removed a few months ago. She barely touched the stuff when she got it and each bottle originally contained 20. Now one bottle has 4.5 and the other has 5.

I'm going to do some research on this. Granted my experience is in Texas but my experience with CPS or APS leads me to believe you are just getting the run around.

Thank you very much.

[ashlynne39]

Well that is utter B S. If a roof over the head was sufficient then cps wouldn't investigate abuse cases as long as the child had a home when the abuse was happening.

I think the implication is that you can bounce your kid from house to house for as long as you want without any repercussions from CPS.

Even with the neglect allegations added to that, it still wasn't enough for them to conduct an interview. Pearl likely hasn't been abused in any overt way (sexual or physical) and while my sister under-feeds her, Pearl is at a decent weight (Steph has a habit of loading her up on juice and milk).

Did you talk to a lawyer up in your area.

I don't have the money for a lawyer, so I called legal aid. She was very flippant and said that the only thing I could do was call DCYF.

Looking back at a calendar, it seems my sister is beginning to show a pattern. Five days after Pearl went to live with her at Karen's, she just had to "get out of here." Five days after we stopped practically raising her child for her while they were with us, she just had to "get out of here." Five days to the day after moving in with Donna, she's now moved back in with Karen. Tuesday marks the next five day period. Donna's husband wants nothing to do with her, so the only other option for her is back with us.

This time, the only one who can move in is Pearl. If that happens we'll fill for Temporary Guardianship. If it doesn't and Pearl no longer has a roof over her head, then I can call DCYF again. My sister is not allowed back in our home. Earlier today, my mother noticed that the cap on one of her bottles of expired Vicodin was not closed properly. My mom had a nasty chronic tooth infection that was finally at a point where it could be removed a few months ago. She barely touched the stuff when she got it and each bottle originally contained 20. Now one bottle has 4.5 and the other has 5.

I'm going to do some research on this. Granted my experience is in Texas but my experience with CPS or APS leads me to believe you are just getting the run around.

Thank you very much.

I sent you a pm