Tim Turner indicted!

[Sparky2]

@ > it’s [sic]
This same word, >it's < was written somewhere (I forget exactly where) in the Constitution of 1787, but it did not have [sic] to the right of it to clear up the meaning. the proper word should have been its, not, it's. Anyone recall this? i.e., it's ?

[Pottapaug1938]

@ > it’s [sic]
This same word, >it's < was written somewhere (I forget exactly where) in the Constitution of 1787, but it did not have [sic] to the right of it to clear up the meaning. the proper word should have been its, not, it's. Anyone recall this? i.e., it's ?

No; and I wouldn't care if I did. The rules of punctuation and grammar were a lot different, in 1787, from what they are today. The frequent Capitalization of Nouns is one example; and there's no way in hell that an important document like the Constitution would have "[sic]" in it, because among other things it would have only confused most people of the time. Even today, you will find many educated people who can't keep "its" and "it's" straight.

The only people who care about this sort of thing are the sovrun idiots who obsess about whether our country is the United States of America or the united States of America, who see a difference between a United States District Court and a District Court of the United (united?) States. The rest of us know better.

[LightinDarkness]

Can one of our resident lawyers explain this to me: on thefogbow.com thread someone posted that the court issued a new order -

It is ORDERED that the oral motion for judgment of acquittal, made in open court by defendant James Timothy Turner at the conclusion of all evidence but before the case was submitted to a jury, is set for submission, without oral argument, on April 12, 2012, with defendant to file his brief by April 5, 2013, and the government to file its brief by April 12, 2013.
--

Now, what I don't get is why the judge would do this. The googles tells me that a "motion for judgement of acquittal" is only granted by the judge in the event that the evidence of the case is insufficient to sustain the conviction. Obviously, there is no way that is the case here. Why would the judge even allow such a motion given that? Or is this just one of those types of motions where everyone gets a hearing on it even if they have no chance in the name of due process?

[fortinbras]

There was evidently a motion to this effect - made by Turner's appointed lawyer, I'll bet, since it's so recondite that Turner himself would not have known to try it - made in the trial. It Very very seldom works, but it's still a possibility -- for example, if the judge detects that what actually happened was not a violation of the criminal statute cited, or that the evidence is too flimsy.
It's hopeless in Turner's case but the appointed lawyer and the judge are dotting all the i's.

[Dr. Caligari]

Now, what I don't get is why the judge would do this. The googles tells me that a "motion for judgement of acquittal" is only granted by the judge in the event that the evidence of the case is insufficient to sustain the conviction. Obviously, there is no way that is the case here. Why would the judge even allow such a motion given that? Or is this just one of those types of motions where everyone gets a hearing on it even if they have no chance in the name of due process?

In every criminal case, the defense lawyer will always this motion as a matter of course. It almost never succeeds, but it is a motion the rules allow, so no lawyer will risk criticism by not making it.

The judge is allowing the defense time to file a brief in support of the motion, but (a) didn't delay sending the case to the jury, and (b) set the motion for decision without argument (the judge will just read the papers and decide). Both are hints (albeit not definitive) that the judge knows this motion is just pro forma.

[notorial dissent]

I think you usually see this in most Federal cases where serious time is involved. I know that in several of the cases I've followed it has been pretty much the standard stuff, and universally read and proforma denied. Usually, I think they wait until after the verdict, but I don't think there is any requirement that they do so, as the result is inevitably the same. I know Jimmy Tim doesn't think he has done anything wrong, and that this will all just go away if they just look at the magic papers he has filed, and that he is FRUSA pretend president for life, and a whole lot more, but just one more in a long line of fantasies. He goin' to jail, and goin' for a real long long time, and he will not even be a footnote in the very short lived FRUSA fantasy.

[ArthurWankspittle]

In every criminal case, the defense lawyer will always this motion as a matter of course. It almost never succeeds, but it is a motion the rules allow, so no lawyer will risk criticism by not making it.

Presumably also you are open to the allegation of failing to properly defend your client if you don't file one of these motions, leading to an appeal on the basis of "badly advised" or whatever the wording is.

[wserra]

Presumably also you are open to the allegation of failing to properly defend your client if you don't file one of these motions, leading to an appeal on the basis of "badly advised" or whatever the wording is.

"Ineffective assistance", in the U.S. But that's not much of a fear. In order to receive a new trial based on it, the defendant must show prejudice - namely, that the motion would likely have succeeded. As Doc C says, that is quite rare. The real reason is simply that you're preserving the record at little effort or expense. Nobody sees everything in the heat of battle.

[Chados]

Directed verdict motions are de rigeur in criminal practice. I call the first one that we see the halftime motion, because it's usually raised at the close of the State's case and before the defense takes the field. Then, after the defense case, there's another one, and then after the verdict comes the motion for judgment non obstante veridicto, the motion for arrest of judgment, and the motion for new trial, to be immediately followed by the notice of appeal to the next higher court, followed by petition for writ of certiorari to the state's highest court or maybe even the U.S. Supreme Court. And then following the appeal comes the Strickland motion challenging trial counsel's effectiveness, to be immediately followed by the habeas corpus motion under s. 2254 in the U.S. District Court and the appeal of that in the U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals and the Round II certiorari petition in the U.S. Supreme Court.

I'm amazed sometimes that any criminal conviction is ever final.

[LightinDarkness]

Well folks it seems as though President Tim still needs the money from all the marks...er citizens of the Republic. Kelby Smith let it slip that they collected $150 total (remember they were requesting $250,000!). I still don't understand why all the 60+ countries that are backing RuSA haven't sent any money! Kelby made a huge deal over the fact that President Tim had a hard time getting pencils and paper and acted like this in and on its own was proof that he didn't get a full trial...because President Tim kept emptying his prison commissary account.

Even now that Tim has been convicted, Chief Propagandist Kelby is acting like the Iraq Communication Minister more than ever. He told everyone on the April 4 conference call that surely Tim will win on appeal because he wasn't tried by a jury of his peers (!) and that he is sure it will go to the Supreme Court where they absolutely will win because Tim didn't get unlimited time in a law library but the government attorneys had an "unlimited budget" to work on their case.

Remember, Kelby Smith is the preeminent legal 'scholar' they've got...and thats the defense they are filing for appeal.

[LightinDarkness]

Apparently Kelby Smith thinks that the US Marshals Service believes RuSA is "a serious organization" and "not a bunch of crazies" because after one of the fake RuSA Senator's testified and left the room one of the marshals addressed him as "Senator." Also, they have now declared its a big deal that "RuSA is now established in law" because they testified about it in Timmys trial and were not challenged - they think its a big deal - even though obviously of course the state didn't challenge, they more they talked about RuSA the more insane they looked. Why would you stop someone from digging their own grave?

[wserra]

Apparently Kelby Smith thinks that the US Marshals Service believes RuSA is "a serious organization" and "not a bunch of crazies" because after one of the fake RuSA Senator's testified and left the room one of the marshals addressed him as "Senator."

In my previous life, I got to know a number of deputy marshalls. I can believe that. Of course, the same deputy calls the guy on the corner who preaches every day while wearing a filthy, wine-stained robe "Father".

Why would you stop someone from digging their own grave?

Because it's in my backyard?

[Gregg]

Because it's in my backyard?

How about if you wanted a flower bed there anyway?

[Chados]

I wouldn't be surprised if one of the deputy Marshals had called the RuSA "senator" by his desired title, or the bum on the corner "Father." All that's doing is avoiding conflict by humoring the subject's cognitive distortions. The subject then feels respected, thanks to the deputy's deft use of his or her interpersonal communication skills, and in this way, the need for employment of reasonable and necessary force to control the situation is avoided. No one had to be assisted to the ground, and everyone leaves happy.

Edit...I'm an idiot and double posted. Been reading too much sui juris today.

[fortinbras]

RuSA sent out this letter from Tim Turner:

Letter from President Turner - April 5, 2013

Greetings in the name of our Lord and Savior Yeshua Ha'Mashiach, Jesus the Christ, and only begotten Son of the living God Yahweh, our Father. I pray that the Lord's blessings are upon you all.

I was surprised that the jury did not have enough concern for another person to at least examine the evidence. Most of the jury claimed to go to church on the questionnaire. I guess that is an indication of how corrupt the churches have become in our day. The Foreman was a minister himself and had no regard for a servant of God at all. God will be just. I am not discouraged, disappointed or dismayed. I love my Father and I know He loves me. All of this somehow fits right into His master plan. I will wait patiently but expectantly for His deliverance that will surely come in His way and His time.

I was told Nita Johnson[1] received a word from the Lord for the Republic. She is a very special woman of God. I would listen very carefully to what she has to say.

After the trial I returned to jail and entered into the Lord's Sabbath. As always my Father was there with me in a great and mighty way. He reminded me that He has everything under control. Nothing that happens will surprise Him, scare Him or hinder His plan. Everything will happen as planned and right on time. The peace and contentment of God is far past my understanding but it is very real. I am not worried, anxious or concerned about what is happening. I know that I am in the center of my Father's Will and that is enough for me.

Many of my enemies are rejoicing about now saying I told you he was no good. They better enjoy their very short time of celebration because it will not last long before they realize God is angry with them. Contrary to what they say or think I have not fallen, got OFF track, slipped, or got sidetracked. I have followed the Lord as he said to, to the best of my ability. We hit a pothole in the road that the Lord put there to help us. When you hit a good sized pothole on the road traveling at a good speed, it knocks loose some of that old greasy oily road dirt and grime that has been collecting under your vehicle. It sticks to the underneath of your vehicle and it isn't easy to break loose so you carry it around. All this has done is shake loose the nasty old grime and cause it to FALL OFF. The Republic has been significantly cleaned up and is being prepared for the next big step. The Lord not only knew the pothole was there, He dug it for our benefit. He is not finished, in fact, He is only getting started.

Don't fret and worry about me. I have been through tough times before that were a lot worse than this. If these guys think this is bad, they should try commercial fishing. That was much harder than being in jail and I enjoyed that. Nobody ever accused me of being real smart. I didn't expect this to be easy. I wasn't sure if I would complete the task. I was sure that I would obey my Father and do as He said when He said without argument, hesitation or fear. I still do not have any fear. How could I have when I have so many of His angels watching over me? Just one of them wiped out 180,000 troops for Gideon in one night. I don't think I am the one who should be afraid. He is on my side and He has lots of back up.

I have been doing a study on the Blood Moons and prophecy. It is amazing how detailed God has things planned. A Blood Moon is a full moon that has an eclipse that happens during one of the Jewish Feasts of Festivals. There is a pattern of these that always happen in pairs two years back to back when significant world events happen. This happened when Israel established the tabernacle in the wilderness after the exodus. It happened again at the time of Christ birth and crucifixion. It happened when the temple was destroyed in Jerusalem. It happened when Israel was re-established in 1948; there were pairs of Blood Moons in 1949 and 1950. It happened again in 1968-1969 after Jerusalem was established as Israel's capital in 1967. According to the study the next two pairs of Blood Moons happens in 2014 and 2015. If the pattern continues that means something awesome will happen between now and 2015. The last Blood Moon of this century happens on September 28, 2015. That is during the Feast of Tabernacles, the Feast of Rejoicing. This follows the Feast of Trumpets which occurs 14 days prior to the feast of Tabernacles. The Feast of Trumpets is when the Jews believe Messiah will come. I don't make predictions but I do like to play with numbers. The scripture Matthew 24:33-34 gives us a clue about when the Lord will come. Two events must happen to identify the last generation. Those are in the KJV bible. The "FIG TREE" must bud and put forth leaves. The Lord revealed to me that the Fig Tree represents Israel in Hosea 9:10. So Israel "budded" in 1948 when it was re-established as a nation, and it "Put forth leaves" in 1967 when Jerusalem was re-established as its capital city once again. The generation that saw those events shall not pass until all of His word is fulfilled and Messiah comes.

That leaves us to define what a generation means. I found a couple of possible references. One is 70 years and I forget the passage of scripture. The other is found in Matthew Chapter One. It lists the number of generations from Abraham to Christ. There are 42 generations. I researched the years and there was 2166 from Abraham to Christ. That means an average generation is 51.5 years. So we have 70 years or 51.5 years that could be a possible generation. This is the interesting part. If you take 1948 and add 70 years you get 2018. If you take 1967 and add 51.5 guess what you get? It is also 2018. I don't predict the coming of our Lord, but I thought that was exciting to discover. At any rate everything was planned and the stars and planets tell the story if we could understand them.

Since there are no more Blood Moons the rest of this century and the Lord himself said this generation shall not pass before He returns, I am looking for amazing things over the next 5 years. Our Lord truly will return and He will not be one minute late. He will be exactly on time and I will be waiting anxiously like a child waiting on Christmas. I look forward to seeing Him and you. That is going to be an awesome celebration and I believe it will be soon.

Keep me posted on prophecies and world events. It is like food to the hungry for me. I love all of you and look forward to giving all of you a great big hug once again. I will hold my head high no matter what the court does. I am proud to be the President of God's republic and proud to be your friend. No matter where this leads, I will gladly endure with patience the struggles I must face for my stand for truth, justice, and righteousness. I will not back down, I will not run and I will not surrender to the evil. Even if I must spend all of my remaining days in prison, I will count it all joy to sacrifice for this righteous cause. I consider it an honor to bear this burden for doing the will of my Father.

God is moving even in this jail. Four inmates received Christ this week. Wherever I may go, God will go before me and prepare my way. If they don't get me out of jail and prison they may not have need of them much longer. The convicts will end up serving the Lord and won't be violating the law and getting arrested.

We are on the brink of a great revival. God is Good. Give our Father the praise for His mighty works. Let our people know I am doing great and am praying for them. The Spirit is upon me, but I need to go for now. God Bless,

In His Service,
James Timothy Turner

[1]Nita Johnson is the president and founder of the World For Jesus Ministries, Inc., a ministry established to reach the world with the love of Jesus. http://www.worldforjesus.org/


Letters to President Turner may be sent to:
James Timothy Turner
#99120 MCDF
P.O. Box 4599
Montgomery, Alabama 36103

I should explain something about this "blood moon" business. I never heard that expression before (except to describe the full moon closest to the autumnal equinox) but the simple fact is that the Jewish calendar is lunar, with the months beginning at the new moon (actually the first visible sliver after the new moon) and the 14th or 15th day of any month occurring at the full moon. At least holidays positively occur on the first day or last day of a month - Rosh Hashona, the 4th or 5th day of Hanukkah - and at least four occur on the 15th day of a month - Sukkos ('Tabernacles'), Tu B'Shevat (arbor day), Shushan Purim, the first day of Passover. There are usually 2 or 3 lunar eclipses during a year - always on the 14th or 15th day of a Jewish month because positively when there's a full moon, and there usually is a solar eclipse visible from some well-populated place once in three or four years, which would coincide with either the last or first day of a Jewish month because it positively must occur at a new moon. Considering the number of eclipses in a year and the positioning of Jewish holidays on the lunar calendar, it is inevitable that one sort of eclipse or another will coincide with a Jewish holiday approximately every fourth year, some rare years having more than one eclipse coincide with Jewish holidays. As this is mathematically unavoidable I am disinclined to see any 'message' in that coincidence.

Anyway, Turner is wrong about the last 'blood moon' of the century being in 2015; a total solar eclipse coincides with Tu B'Shevat in January 2018, a lunar eclipse occurs at the same holiday one year later, an annular solar eclipse occurs on the 4th day of Hanukkah in Dec. 2019, a total solar eclipse on the same 4th day one year later and again a year after that. A lunar penumbral eclipse on Shushan Purim, in March 2024, and so on.

[GlimDropper]

Well, Tim did say that:

Nobody ever accused me of being real smart.

And if they did the charges would be dropped for lack of evidence.

This is Tim's pattern, any of the oh so very many times the republic suffered a setback he traded his presidential podium for a pulpit. In fact from it's birth Tim's republic has been a faith based movement. After he finished purging the rest of the "Guardian Elders" from the Restore America Plan, Regan Reedy and Tom Shaults started offering up their own alternative to what Tim was selling and they had a few strong debating points. Nothing Tim had promised ever materialized (they sorta had to gloss over the fact that they'd been promising the same things) and they pointed to a failure of leadership.

There was a brief and amusing moment when both rival groups were arguing over which of them held claim to call themselves THE Restore America Plan, both sides said the other one did. It was during that little game of hot potato that Tim Turner announced the birth of the Republic for the united States and he did it not so much with one of his conference calls but more like a prayer meeting.

From that point on he didn't so much brazen his way through questions like "what are the 150 nations that recognize the republic" so much as he'd fall back on "God has his plan, and I know his plan is greater than my plans." If you could keep your skin from crawling at him taking God's name in vain for long enough you'd recognize that it was really clever management strategy. All the people who wanted simple answers to honest questions either left the republic or shut up and grabbed a hymnal. Anytime something like the ID printing machines getting stolen happened, it wasn't a hair brained scheme blowing up, it was a lesson from God. I love the fact that Tim claims that God dug the "pothole" he just hit I just wish he'd admit that God "used" Tim's hands to work the shovel. Well, that and admitting that God had nothing to do with it.

[Paul]

Jesus the Christ, and only begotten Son of the living God Yahweh, our Father

OK, so Yahweh is my Father, but Jesus is His only son, so that makes me his daughter?

[LaVidaRoja]

WOW!!! (acronym for Walks On Water) THAT'S why gay marriage should NOT be an issue to the ultra-religious!!

[Chados]

Dude's gone waaaaaayyyyy over to the wackadoodle side. Way. Over.

[LightinDarkness]

So now that some time has passed since the sentencing:

(1) Can I get recordings of any part of the trial? I know court trials are not normally popcorn eating material, but you know this one is, and I need something to listen to when I clean my apartment.

(2) Any further ideas on what type of sentence we might expect (shouldn't that be coming up soon)?

Whats hilarious is RuSA still cliams Timmy is President, I wonder if that will change when hes sentenced...although I have noticed we no longer have weekly updated on how Timmy's been doing as we did when he was first arrested. I suspect whats left of the (decimated) RuSA leadership has learned telling people your the real government but your "President" is in jail awaiting sentencing is not good for public relations.