Stock and Bond Fraud, including Boiler Rooms / Pump and Dump Schemes, Mutual Fund & Hedge Fund Fraud, FOREX scams, plus Churning, Private Placements, Venture and Bridge Funding, IPOs, Viaticals Fraud, HYIP and Prime Bank scams, MTNs, Historical Notes, Recovery Schemes, etc. Includes the Jim Norman Project and the Michael Dotson Project and similar HYIP scams.
Tednewsom wrote:Then there's this odd discrepancy which, I'm sure, has a reasonable explanation.
Which is why I suggested people simply call and get the story straight from the horses mouth. Call and ask about the 12,000 and see if the amount is quoted differently. Call about the 19,000 deal. Hear what Gillis has to say and post here.
This 19,000-25,000 or whatever you have been saying still seems like there's a third party involved with their own mark up. I have a hunch that there is someone buying machines for 12k through NAS and simply charging 19k to others, but that information was none of my business, right?
worried wrote:There's nothing to argue SomeYuppie .... you're wasting your time (or worse) by saying anything other than:
GO HIRE YOUR OWN FINANCIAL LEGAL ADVICE BEFORE HANDING OVER YOUR MONEY...
Anything else is just propaganda of one sort or another
While telling people to hire an expert is normally good advice, it's also bad advice here as this board has already attracted experts that have already been hired by their clients to do DD.
Now you're just lying... I let a couple of your previous posts go which were just lies as well... Name ONE post that is actually somebody "doing DD" by posting here. There is none, you're either a liar, or very stupid. Sorry, but that's the truth. There was at least one poster who was simply SHARING his experience as a financial professional who had never been able to get Gillis to respond to his queries for REAL financial information...
If you have to "Believe" something, that means you can't prove that it's true... please, for your own sake, speak and act accordingly...
MarvinGardens wrote:I'm new on this board and encountered it because I have a client who owns leaseback contracts with Nationwide Automated Systems, Inc. (NASI) and I'm doing due diligence.
To anybody else who seems to care as much as SomeYuppie.... read very carefully MarvinGardins first post (page 3 or 4?), especially the last few paragraphs.... and think hard... is this guy REALLY a financial professional (even retired)? He would "like to ask Gillis for financial statements but would rather someone else did"?.... really?... you believe that?....from a "professional"?.... edit: I have to take some of this back... I read a later (and longer) post by MarvinGardins more carefully. I think the issue is not that MG isn't 'professional', it's that visiting this forum didn't constitute his 'doing Due Diligence'. Read his posts and you'll see that he actually did do some real digging and then said that he would never recommend NASI due to the INABILITY to COMPLETE the due diligence investigation (lack of information from NASI).... apologies to MG (if he even cares what I think .... the point still stands though, SomeYuppie was lamely attempting to cast doubt on the wisdom of seeking professional advice before blindly handing your money to Gillis or anybody else...
The advice to HIRE A REAL LEGAL/FINANCIAL PROFESSIONAL means to CHECK to make sure that professional is actually CERTIFIED (kept current) by state authorities. The certification/license numbers can be checked against state databases for any bad information....
The fact that somebody posts on here pretending to be a professional DOES NOT MEAN that he IS a professional.... and it DOES NOT MEAN that you should not hire your OWN REAL professional....
There have been several posters on this forum whose one goal seems to be to generate a smoke-screen to hide this message:
HIRE YOUR OWN LEGAL/FINANCAL ADVICE BEFORE HANDING OVER YOUR MONEY
Last edited by worried on Thu Jan 30, 2014 11:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
If you have to "Believe" something, that means you can't prove that it's true... please, for your own sake, speak and act accordingly...
Why do posters like SomeYuppy, BeverlyHillsMan, imnewhere, etc., even care?
Isn't the business they've invested in safe and secure? Isn't it better for THEM if noone else knows about it so they can have more of the new "opportunities" for themselves?... think about it.... or,... are they trying to drum up new 'business' to feed the ponzi scheme....??....
I've already stated why *I* care.... I have a family member who is in way too deep and is in deep denial... before I learned of that I would never have cared at all....
Last edited by worried on Thu Jan 30, 2014 7:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
If you have to "Believe" something, that means you can't prove that it's true... please, for your own sake, speak and act accordingly...
Is it a good idea to HIRE YOUR OWN LEGAL FINANCIAL ADVICE BEFORE HANDING OVER MONEY?
I'd hire a legal and or financial professional/advisor, but I would not hire advice. I wouldn't know how to 1099 it.
Anyways I invest in plenty of stocks, so I guess I should never seek any information on my own since I already invested in it. I have this amazing company called Enron in my portfolio. It all must be 100% safe though since they are registered with the SEC and hire independent auditors.
Is it a good idea to HIRE YOUR OWN LEGAL FINANCIAL ADVICE BEFORE HANDING OVER MONEY?
I'd hire a legal and or financial professional/advisor, but I would not hire advice. I wouldn't know how to 1099 it.
Amazing, SO... hiring a financial professional IS a good idea after all.... and just buying 'investments' because a 'friend' has been successful at it, or it 'feels' right is NOT a good idea... right?
Anyways I invest in plenty of stocks, so I guess I should never seek any information on my own since I already invested in it. I have this amazing company called Enron in my portfolio. It all must be 100% safe though since they are registered with the SEC and hire independent auditors.
??? ... What is your point here?.... You seem to be saying two things:
1. It's too late for my NASI investment because I already bought into it... FALSE... you CAN and SHOULD PAY for IMPARTIAL financial advice to know what to do starting NOW.
2. Uhh... you're saying that other investor's have been led astray even by their own financial professionals, therefore, don't bother...??... so just default back to investing on emotion...??.. really..???...
Just more smoke-screen people...
HIRE FINANCIAL/LEGAL ADVICE BEFORE HANDING OVER YOUR MONEY
If you have to "Believe" something, that means you can't prove that it's true... please, for your own sake, speak and act accordingly...
... and SomeYuppie hasn't elaborated on why he cares so much to post on here in the first place... if Gillis and NASI are indeed completely honest, legitimate (and somehow secretly registered with the SEC in a way that we can't see), then nobody should care what anybody else says here, right?
If you have to "Believe" something, that means you can't prove that it's true... please, for your own sake, speak and act accordingly...
worried wrote:
??? ... What is your point here?.... You seem to be saying two things:
1. It's too late for my NASI investment because I already bought into it... FALSE... you CAN and SHOULD PAY for IMPARTIAL financial advice to know what to do starting NOW.
2. Uhh... you're saying that other investor's have been led astray even by their own financial professionals, therefore, don't bother...??... so just default back to investing on emotion...??.. really..???...
Just more smoke-screen people...
HIRE FINANCIAL/LEGAL ADVICE BEFORE HANDING OVER YOUR MONEY
You've been all over the place so I'm trying to respond to your concerns. I don't know how you interpreted what I said to form point 2, and what you interpreted to form point 1 came from when you said:
"Why do posters like SomeYuppy, BeverlyHillsMan, imnewhere, etc., even care?
Isn't the business they've invested in safe and secure?"
rogfulton wrote:The investment constitutes a security because the law states it is and several courts have said it is.
I hate to say that there's basic legal fundamentals that you are ignoring, but there are.
To recap:
1) Investment here does not pass Howey test as being a security
2) Every case presented thus far in this thread has had a material difference in the facts
Are you certain you are the only 'investor' with that list of serial numbers? Are you certain the person you spoke to at the business was not acting on instructions from NAS? Are you certain that you have not violated your agreement by contacting the businesses? Have you personally verified the existence of 'your' machines at 'your' locations?
Reread the thread dude.
It doesn't matter if you think the investment does or does not pass the Howey test, only what is decided in a court. Several decisions have been cited by other posters which says an ATM lease back is a security based on analysis of the Howey test. You are ignoring those.
The material difference in the facts you are clinging so desparately to are irrelevant to the fact courts have found ATM leaseback schemes to be investments.
I did reread the thread before I wrote those questions. You still haven't answered any of them.
In fact, you haven't provided direct responsive answers to very many (if any) of the questions that have been posted to you.
I will add one more of my own and use larger font so it can't be missed. I hope the other posters will forgive me if it's already been asked.
Have you investigated any of our claims with anyone, other than the person who refered you to the scheme or the seller?
"No man is above the law and no man is below it; nor do we ask any man's permission when we require him to obey it. Obedience to the law is demanded as a right; not asked as a favor."
- President Theodore Roosevelt
SomeYuppie wrote:This thread has been alive for 1571 days and I don't think it went anywhere.
It's gone plenty of places. It's not our fault if you don't catch on to anything.
"We've been attacked by the intelligent, educated segment of the culture." -- Pastor Ray Mummert, Dover, PA, during an attempt to introduce creationism -- er, "intelligent design", into the Dover Public Schools
.... the point still stands though, SomeYuppie was lamely attempting to cast doubt on the wisdom of seeking professional advice before blindly handing your money to Gillis or anybody else...
