Dean Clifford - A Tale of Two Gurus

[arayder]

Standard operating procedure among freeman wannabes is to ignore the assurances of success given them by their gurus and blame the cult's zero-for-life batting average on what they see as evil judges, corrupt courts and sell out corporate governments.

Since these people and institutions are seen by freeman cult members as incapable of adminstring justice they see no need in reviewing court records, reading case law or studying the origins and nature of the law of western democracies.

Instead, the freemen's education comes from plopping themselves down in front of a computer screen and watching the YouTubes of their pseudo scholar gurus.

Sources report gatherings of well indoctrinated, poorly educated often stoned or drunk freemen wannabes showing up at basement gatherings and outside courtrooms. According to reports these events provide soap boxes for overbearing gurus in training and an opportunity for the rank and file to socialize and take their favorite drugs.

One needs only view the YouTube taken at Dean Clifford's arrest to see erupted the mass insanity lurking under the surface of the freeman cult.

[notorial dissent]

arayder, I think you are pretty much right on the cult end of it. Their guru can't possibly be wrong, and it is easier to blame the courts for ignoring their nonsense magic documents than accept the fact that they could be wrong.

I suspect the earlier version of the Freeman groups were probably largely alcohol fueled, just as the modern ones are probably more pot fueled. Not having a clue to begin with coupled with further auxiliary mental impairment makes for a fertile ground for this sort of thing, and when they stay that way most of the time anyway, it really gets entertaining.

[Jeffrey]

If anyone's interested, Dean's webmaster has uploaded two clips from the Seminar he was arrested at.

It's really nothing that merits discussion.

[Hilfskreuzer Möwe]

The Manitoba Courts database indicates that Dean Clifford has a hearing scheduled for 10:00 a.m., Thursday March 6, 2014. As with the previous hearing, this event is occurring on the same file as his Feb. 2013 habeas corpus application that was struck off the list.

The database offers no other useful hints on the subject of the hearing, it is simply identified as a "criminal uncontested motion". That is the same as the two other occasions Dean was at the Manitoba Court of Queen's Bench.

Whatever this is, it seems to be separate from the March 7, 2014 1:00 p.m. hearing mentioned on the deanclifford.info website (http://deanclifford.info/2014/02/06/nex ... march-7th/).

I searched the 'usual places' for any indication from the Clifford camp on what the March 6 hearing may represent. Those sources make no mention of this hearing at all.

I checked the Federal Courts database to see if I could locate any trace of the legal action Dean says he has initiated in that court. Nothing. To be cautious I searched for any "Clifford" file that might match. The only "Dean Clifford" litigation I located was the two income tax collection actions that date from the early 2000's.

SMS Möwe

[arayder]

Let me guess. . .ah, in the next several days the Dean team will release a recorded phone call between Dean, who will be talking from jail, and his chortling brother.

The phone call will be heavily laced with the F word and Dean will call the judge and the prosecutor stupid. Dean will brag about how he plans to sue the pants off all of 'em.

Despite an all too obvious edge on his voice Dean will tell faithful freeman listeners that jail is a piece of cake, that he can do the time standing on his head, and that he doesn't intend to leave (not that they're letting him out) until he has dealt with the powers that be.

There will be a fair amount of whining about not having access to word processors, computers, the internet and e-mail. In subsequent parts of the call Dean will contradict this whine by claiming he has, indeed, filed all the papers he needs to, but the evil courts have ignored his brilliance.

There will be some more cussing, name calling of the authorities and then time will be up. . .

[Jeffrey]

faithful freeman listeners

I suspect there aren't that many left after ~4 months in jail.

[Hilfskreuzer Möwe]

faithful freeman listeners

I suspect there aren't that many left after ~4 months in jail.

One would think that, but Dean's March 7, 2014 hearing Facebook Event (https://www.facebook.com/events/722014431165059/) indicates 55 people plan to attend the courthouse on that date.

Of course, it's rather plausible that the number of physical bodies will be fewer than those who are present in heart, soul, and spirit.

SMS Möwe

[Jeffrey]

There's so much wrong in that Facebook post.

Dean isn't a political prisoner.
He's not being held illegally.
He wasn't kidnapped.
Absolutely no mention of why he was arrested.
Nonsense about the writ of habeas corpus.
Nonsense about his gibberish writs being ignored.
Lying that there was no warrant.
Spinning the slow process due to overburdened courts as them "dragging the process out".

transcripts procured to date are clearly not a true re-enactment

This is just denialism at its best. Since the limited transcripts we have to date show that Dean's magic words and arguments don't work then the transcripts must be faked in their mind.

This won't be very entertaining until the trial / conviction.

[arayder]

There's so much wrong in that Facebook post.
. . .Spinning the slow process due to overburdened courts as them "dragging the process out".

transcripts procured to date are clearly not a true re-enactment

This is just denialism at its best. Since the limited transcripts we have to date show that Dean's magic words and arguments don't work then the transcripts must be faked in their mind.

This won't be very entertaining until the trial / conviction.

My sense of the process is that it is also being drawn out by Clifford's refusal to participate. He doesn't want a lawyer yet won't agree to properly handle the court documents and evidence gathered against him.

As near as I can tell every time the court tries to interact with him in or outside the hearings he goes into Clifford/freeman mode and chatters on like a freeman at a traffic stop, thus refusing to let the process move on.

I can't imagine, based on Clifford's own rambling reports, that he has even entered a plea.

It seems to me the court is going to lengths to assure he's treated fairly, even to the point of spelling out the proper way to file docents and motions with the court. True to form Clifford makes the court's adherence to due process and fair play into some sort of conspiracy.

The freeman culture of victimhood is in full swing.

[Jeffrey]

Arayder's prediction was disturbingly accurate. Dean's latest update from jail is out.

I'm not sure how much of a discussion it merits. Dean is still confused about the courthouse directives document he received, which means he either still hasn't read it, lacks the capacity to understand it, or is misreading it on purpose to confuse his followers.

[arayder]

Dean whines that the courts won't accept his documents then seems to forget what he trying to put over on his dupes when minutes later starts talking about how hard it was on him and his brother (. . this is may other brother, Darren) to develop the documents he now says he has filed.

Apparently Dean's out of jail network struggles with writing out the documents, e-mailing and faxing them and a few other basics of law school 101.

[GlimDropper]

Arayder's prediction was disturbingly accurate. Dean's latest update from jail is out.

[Link]

So Dean's opened a coffee shop? If so I hope he figures out how to make lattes because he seems kinda confused about the issue.


Kidding aside, to Dean and his fans. we aren't rejoicing because an honest seeker for truth was thrown in jail. We're laughing at the ridiculous lies Dean tells to try and explain why the magic tricks he tries to sell people don't even work for him.

What's this BS about an obstruction of justice because they wont give him access to a notary? I mean I assume it's because the freeman magic doesn't work without the right stamps but from a practical level, can what he legitimately needs to file with the court from prison be procedurally ignored because it wasn't notarized?

I think I know the answer but I'd appreciate comment from those more familiar with the Canadian (or CANADIAN) justice system.

And that bit about his submissions being denied because they were on lined paper, the only type of paper he has access to, I think I can guess what that's about. I doubt he made that up out of whole cloth he's just not telling the truth. I bet the lined paper thing (and evidence tabs) were included as an examples of "not in appropriate document form" that were pointed out but not used as a substantive reason his filing was dismissed. Sorta like "While the documents aren't in the proper format we could ignore that, what we can't ignore is that his arguments are bull crap and would still be bull crap if the paper didn't have lines."

[Jeffrey]

It's a slow sunday so let's have some fun dissecting the call.

It's very annoying for him to claim that his documents are being ignored because they're not notarized. The directives he received instructing him how to properly file applications do not mention anywhere that a notary is required. The word notary doesn't appear anywhere in the document and in fact state clearly on page 9 that even if an application doesn't meet the proper filing requirements, those requirements are entirely optional. Glim's theory about the paper is spot on, they probably told him "this is gibberish and it's not even in the proper format" and Dean heard "we're ignoring it because it's in the wrong format". Or, he's just lying.

There are two reasons for them "ignoring" Dean's documents. Primarily as Mowe points, out, the writs he's submitting don't have any orthodox meaning. Although he nominally refers to it as a "writ to show cause", based on his description of the writ it's more like a writ of habeus corpus or quo warranto, since he wants to know how are they able to charge him under a code that he believes only applies to government employees. Essentially the same old Section 32 argument that's been tried and failed.

The second reason is stated on page 19 of the document he was given, and that is that the court can just dismiss any frivolous applications he submits.

In any case, it's already been explained to him what the "cause" is. He violated the firearms act, controlled substances act, and some other stuff in the criminal code. The court has jurisdiction regardless of whether he calls himself a non-resident or whatever he's trying to argue.

Just to illustrate how absurd his argument is, the same code he's being charged with breaking also contains the laws against murder in Canada. The same arguments he is trying to make, if they were true, would also allow you to murder people.

[arayder]

For Dean, having convinced his cult that Canada is a business run out of Washington D.C. which they can ignore like the Starbucks down the street, it isn't a stretch to try to sell the idea that he's being railroaded.

After losing three trucks to confiscation, losing countless civil suits, being jailed several times, this time over serious matters, Inmate Dean has no real choice except to continue his attempts at controling the minds of his minions.

Thus the sad self-delusion that, from his jail cell, he has the authorities just where he wants them is about the only lie Dean has left. The other one is that when he "gets out" he's going to kick the arses of the powers that be on a full time basis!

Dean knows how well the ruse plays with his dupes. After all he filled a room full of $150 a pop gullibles for his latest seminar. We all saw how crazed they were at Dean's arrest.

Dean knows his fantasy of powerfulness plays well with the sad freeman livin' in mamma's basement. Dean tells these un/under employed, single/divorced, can't pay the mortgage losers that none of the mess that is their lives is their fault. . . .the trouble, the blame is with the boss, the bank, the cops, the courts and the government.

One might wonder how it is this little community of the delusional manages to function at all. It's simple. The cult employs a self reinforcing loop of denial which stubbornly ignores reality and personal responsibility.

To freemen the boss didn't understand what they said about their SIN numbers or how he had no right to drug test them.

The ex didn't get it that her free-man was really ensuring their future by spending hour after hour on the internet discussing freemanism.

The cop couldn't grasp he was traveling, not driving a car.

So why shouldn't the Dean faithful buy the idea that his motions, which we know are frivolous, are really brilliant submissions ignored by the judges who tremble in fear at the mere mention of Dean's name!

That's the way the self reinforcing loop of denial works!

[Hilfskreuzer Möwe]

... What's this BS about an obstruction of justice because they wont give him access to a notary? I mean I assume it's because the freeman magic doesn't work without the right stamps but from a practical level, can what he legitimately needs to file with the court from prison be procedurally ignored because it wasn't notarized?

I think I know the answer but I'd appreciate comment from those more familiar with the Canadian (or CANADIAN) justice system.

And that bit about his submissions being denied because they were on lined paper, the only type of paper he has access to, I think I can guess what that's about. I doubt he made that up out of whole cloth he's just not telling the truth. I bet the lined paper thing (and evidence tabs) were included as an examples of "not in appropriate document form" that were pointed out but not used as a substantive reason his filing was dismissed. Sorta like "While the documents aren't in the proper format we could ignore that, what we can't ignore is that his arguments are bull crap and would still be bull crap if the paper didn't have lines."

I think your explanation is plausible, Glimdropper. I can't comment on the policy in Manitoba courts but I have personally in other jurisdictions encountered entirely hand-written court applications that were accepted without complaint by the court. In some cases the handwritten variant has been quite impressive, in that the litigant has very carefully doppeled the format and content of what is usually a typeset document.

Further, many Canadian court applications use a form, with blank spaces, and it is entirely typical that forms of that kind will be completed by hand. It of course helps if the writing is neat and legible, but I can certainly confirm that 'borderline' applications, both in legibility and content, are accepted and used as a basis for court proceedings.

I am not aware of any need to notarize a typical court application document. A notary or commissioner of oaths would usually be required to prepare a formal affidavit - however I have again seen irregular documents accepted.

There's another possible explanation for why Dean is complaining he can't get notary services - and that is that in some Canadian jurisdictions the Law Societies and Notary Societies have instructed that their members to refuse to notarize irregular OPCA documents. This is to prevent 'ceremonial' notarization from nevertheless apparently potentially validating these illegal/meaningless documents: Meads v. Meads, 2012 ABQB 571 at paras. 643-645.

So, it's entirely possible that Dean is approaching a notary in the remand facility and asking him/her to notarize his magical documents, only to be told "Nope - this is Freeman crap, and I won't touch it." This has become a real issue in Freeman circles: in fact there is a subforum in the World Freeman Society website entirely devoted to attempts to find compliant notaries.

Given Dean's 'winning ways', I can well imagine that any notary in the remand facility would hesitate to notarize/commission what even seems like a normal, potentially valid document request.

SMS Möwe

[Jeffrey]

For context, this are the directives that Dean is referring to. Note the absence of any mention of notarization requirements.

http://www.manitobacourts.mb.ca/pdf/not ... 4_2013.pdf

I'm having trouble recalling which lecture he said this in but, according to pre-2014 Clifford, a notary isn't even required. Remember in one of his heroic stories about his last trip to jail in 2013, Dean claimed that since he didn't have access to a notary and needed to write up an affidavit, he simply used God as a witness.

[notorial dissent]

If memory serves, most courts aren't at all fussy about that, particularly if the documents are coming from someone on "remand" as they can be proven in court as necessary.

The average Freeman/sovrun idjit, in my experience, puts great mystical faith in that notary stamp, and if it isn't there, then their magic document has no mojo, or at least that is their excuse, and if they can collect an apostille, then it is even more magical.

It's also a convenient excuse for why their magic documents aren't working are getting laughed at/tossed out/ignored, and why they are still in jail, anything but that the documents are the veriest of meaningless garbage.

[arayder]

. . .most courts aren't at all fussy about that [document format], particularly if the documents are coming from someone on "remand" as they can be proven in court as necessary.

The average Freeman/sovrun idjit, in my experience, puts great mystical faith in that notary stamp. . .

It's also a convenient excuse for why their magic documents aren't working are getting laughed at/tossed out/ignored, and why they are still in jail, anything but that the documents are the veriest of meaningless garbage.

Exactly. Since the ruse is so thin and obviously untruthful it would seem that freemen gurus and practitioners are looking for the excuse.

I postulate that they have been running this gambit for so long they hardly realize that what they are doing is essentially telling a lie.

[notorial dissent]

Never underestimate the possibility that they are just really really stupid and actually believe in it.

[arayder]

Never underestimate the possibility that they are just really really stupid and actually believe in it.

I hear ya'!

The dumbest kid I knew in youth baseball never figured out that going zero for the season at the plate was an indication he ought to dump his Mel Ott swing http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g67Krs5fVDo for one that would let him get his bat around.

It took the pitchers in the league about 30 seconds to figure out the kid couldn't handle a steady diet of fastballs.