National Liberty Alliance - Citizen Grand Juries

[LightinDarkness]

Few other interesting tidbits. John keeps a counter of how many counties are "constituted" and I've noticed the number has been going up a lot - from a handful of counties in a few states to something like all counties in 20 or so states.

In the NLA mythology, "constituting" your sov'run grand jury involves

(1) Putting a public notice in a local paper,
(2) Holding a vote at the place listed in that notice (no quorum necessary, 1 person showing up is enough, and according to John only 1 person has to vote for it even if no one else does because its your sov'run right),
(3) Filling out some sov'run gibberish forums and buying a sov'run seal, NLA provides template gibberish forms for you,
(4) Filing said gibberish with the local county court (if the court rejects it, thats OK according to John, since you were just providing them notice)

Now this isn't all that difficult in terms of made up sov'run rituals - after all, only 1 person per county is needed even if 1 million people vote against it. But tonight John revealed hes changed the rules! Turns out it was taking to long to "constitute" the counties using this method, so now they are holding 1 single state wide meeting and even if no one shows up its assumed they voted yes.

So instead of thousands of people - it would be 3,000+ if you had 1 grand juror sov'run in every county - its more like 100-200 crazies that are doing these forms and meetings for every county in their state all at once. Its hilarious because Darash loves talking about how they are "the people" and they exercise the will of "the people" - indeed.

[LPC]

(5) John is still planning a trip to Washington DC to the Supreme Court to show everyone the power of his legal paperwork. But he insists on not doing it until 1/2 to 2/3 of the country has formed their citizen grand juries.

Could we call his bluff?

He's got a citizens' grand jury in NY, so that's one.

I hereby declare myself to be the Unified Citizens' Grand Jury for Pennsylvania. So that's two.

Or is it? Is this like a franchise, where you have to register and pay a fee, and submit the right kind of gibberish paperwork, or it doesn't count?

[LightinDarkness]

(5) John is still planning a trip to Washington DC to the Supreme Court to show everyone the power of his legal paperwork. But he insists on not doing it until 1/2 to 2/3 of the country has formed their citizen grand juries.

Could we call his bluff?

He's got a citizens' grand jury in NY, so that's one.

I hereby declare myself to be the Unified Citizens' Grand Jury for Pennsylvania. So that's two.

Or is it? Is this like a franchise, where you have to register and pay a fee, and submit the right kind of gibberish paperwork, or it doesn't count?

Nope, only "works" if you file John's sov'run gibberish and get you a fancy seal. Although its not clear why John gets to determine what makes up a sov'run grand jury. I think you should show up with a seal with "Nunc Pro Tunc, Pizza Pizza" on it and try to stamp his papers.

[notorial dissent]

Now we see the grift coming in to play, rather like Jimmy Tim and his magic RuSA identity documents that he was charging an arm and a leg for until even that crowd got wise.

I'm just betting that any time now he'll come up with more things they need to shell money for to be part of the cool kids.

Only problem is that I think he's waited a bit to long and the wheels are starting to come off the model T. The judicial system isn't falling all over itself to follow his dictates and they are sooner, rather than later going to find themselves in front of a real judge, in real trouble.

I think this may well be a scam whose time has passed.

[grixit]

Oh dear, the NLA crazies have put together enough money to launch a 120 hour, 600 question course in sov'run law. It will be up in the next few weeks and John Darash is going to require every NLA sov'run juror to "pass" the test before they can be certified (heh) to be a sov'run juror.

I wonder what percent of the testees will actually be able to sharpen a number 2 pencil.

And how many of the examiners will be able to operate a scanitron.

[notorial dissent]

If they are doing this on line as some sources I've seen seem to indicate, it really wouldn't cost them anything more than server time and space. I really can't imagine that they have the kind of money it would take to do hard copy of that amount, or to be able to afford the postage, even if only one way.

I think it sounds awfully ambitious for a crowd that can’t even figure out how to properly file a paper in court, and I still think it is a lead up to some kind of scam.

It would be interesting to get hold of copies if only to see the fantasies they are peddling as actual fact, I mean, anyone who uses Badnarik as a source is out there just a bit.

[fortinbras]

About 6 weeks ago, when I first heard of these people, and saw that they were recruiting, I was tempted to join and figured that I would try to bring a little sense into their lives and then write a magazine article about it. But this latest launch into what is outright crime makes me glad that I hesitated; I'd bet the FBI would not believe that I joined up to swim against the tide.

[LightinDarkness]

Updates from everyone's favorite deranged sov'runs over at the National Liberty Alliance. The NLA has now "indicted" via gibberish "common law true bill" federal district judge Glenn Suddaby. This is the federal judge that threw out the NLA's attempt to have their "case" hear in federal court, which was sure to (according to John Darash) get the NLA free reign over all courts so they could start playing grand jury. The indictment is a hysterical read:

http://www.nationallibertyalliance.com/ ... uddaby.pdf

I am sort of wondering when John Darash will get taken to court over this. He really is the leader of this group and if he was arrested, the entire thing would collapse. Hes now filed so much gibberish paperwork that the case would be an easy win for the government over counterfeit legal processes, and I am pretty sure acting like you are indicting federal judges is a serious federal crime.

[notorial dissent]

We keep hearing about how big this groups is and blah blah blah, but is it really anything just more that Darash having gotten access to a computer and printer? You certainly never hear of anyone else being involved in his attempt at paper terrorism. Other than NAL, who or what is/was he?

Just out of confusion, where in the 5th Amendment does it say anything whatsoever about "common law" Grand Jury? I must have that abridged version of the amendments or something.

At least they were a little less wordy in this presentment, it only ran to 5 pages of nonsense instead of the usual 20-30.

[LightinDarkness]

We keep hearing about how big this groups is and blah blah blah, but is it really anything just more that Darash having gotten access to a computer and printer? You certainly never hear of anyone else being involved in his attempt at paper terrorism. Other than NAL, who or what is/was he?

Just out of confusion, where in the 5th Amendment does it say anything whatsoever about "common law" Grand Jury? I must have that abridged version of the amendments or something.

At least they were a little less wordy in this presentment, it only ran to 5 pages of nonsense instead of the usual 20-30.

Darash is definitely the leader and responsible for a vast majority of the gibberish paperwork. And because of his new "procedure" for "establishing" grand juries in each county, it only takes a handful of people per state to convene common law gibberish juries under his made-up procedures.

However, while its certainly not the biggest group of sov'runs I've seen (that would be RuSA at its peak, which probably had 3,000 or so people), he does have at least 1,000 active people involved. He constantly trots out how 3,000 people are signed up to be grand jurors on his webesite and 10,000 people visit it daily, but most of the people signed up are fair weather sov'runs who will flee if he gets arrested or runs into any real legal trouble. Many of the people sign up and then aren't active, but I'd say hes got a good 800-1,000 active sov'runs on this.

As for where the "common law" part of the 5th amendment is, Darash would tell you that everything in the constitution refers to "common law" implicitly and its just been subverted by the de facto evil corporate government. Of course we know in reality that sov'run "common law" has no relationship to actual common law (setting case law via precedent), but as you know these guys are not the smartest bunch.

By the way, Darash has also revealed his plans if he doesn't get the response from this latest gibberish (although its SURE to work this time, guys!). He will next move up to SCOTUS and the indict the entire court if they don't do what he wants, and if that doesn't work he'll next indict the entire judicial system of the United States (big U for corporate, of course).

[LightinDarkness]

One last thing...Darash has announced that all Sheriffs and other elected officials will be required to take his 120 hour 600 question "common law" sov'run gibberish course. Anyone who does not shall be indicted.

Delusions of grandeur...

[notorial dissent]

Delusions of grandeur...

To say the very least.

The reason I asked the one question is that I don't remember seeing anyone else attaching their signatures, fake or otherwise, to any of his magic gibberish documents, and I seriously expect that if he ever gets questioned on it he'll claim "That ain't mine", on the documents. I know there has been a lot of "interest" on the website and whatnot, although a lot is at best curiosity, official and otherwise, I think I've even ended up there a time or two. I just keep wondering if most of them aren't imaginary followers, kind of like his imaginary friends and imaginary powers as a grand jury of one.

[LightinDarkness]

Yeah, the whole no name on anything is deliberate. Darash noticed early on in doing all this that no one wanted to volunteer to sign all the gibberish documents for fear giving their identities over to law enforcement. So, as part of his on-going made up grand jury mythology, he has declared that no one needs to actually identify themselves on any gibberish document and to make squiggly nonsense signatures as well.

Of course, in real grand juries the jury members are (I think) confidential, but that doesn't mean no one knows who is on the grand jury. I presume the DA and certain court staff are well aware.

[fortinbras]

When I was on a grand jury (in DC circa 1987), we were all given a list of the members of our panel, with phone numbers and the like.

[morrand]

Tailing onto the Cherron Phillips trial, Mark Brown of the Sun-Times talks about the NLA in today's paper:

I had a nice chat Wednesday with the group's Illinois coordinator. He declined to give his name, but we'll call him Gary, because that really is his name ....

As is common with sovereign citizens, Gary dismisses the court system that governs the rest of us as "maritime courts."

"If you walk into most of your courthouses, what do you see? A pond and a pool," Gary said when I challenged him.

If that doesn't settle it for you, check out the fringe on the flags in those courthouses.

"That's a maritime flag," Gary said.

Hard to argue with logic like that.

Mark Brown, "Road to liberty paved with denial," Chicago Sun-Times, June 19, 2014, 22.

Evidently, NLA is planning to do the vote on Saturday to constitute the Illinois grand juries, in a pizza parlor. "Nunc pro tunc, pizza pizza," indeed.

[Chados]

Hi guys,

I've been off the boards for a few months-real life and all. good to see all the Quatloosians again!

I noticed this thread and wanted to jump in-we had some NLA here in Central Florida. They've drunk the koolaid, we had a demand to let them use our courthouse! We have also had a fake order of their false grand jury returning a "presentment" against a couple prosecutors. We prosecuted the chairman of their fraudulent grand jury and he did about three-four months in the county jail for it...and I got their fake presentment stricken from the court record. They're a real bunch of characters.

[wserra]

In the latest attempt by Unified Grand Idiots to emulate Clarence Darrow, they have mailed a bunch of postcards to the Chief Judge of NYND "demanding" that he sign the Big-Ol'-Writ-of-Mandumbass I posted about above. Yes, really, postcards.

Can carrier pigeons be far behind?

[LightinDarkness]

Chados - How recently was the jailing of the NLA guy? I find it interesting that nothing has been said about that on the conference calls, I would think such an event would result in an avalanche of more gibberish paperwork directly at the presiding judge from John Darash.

Wserra - Believe it or not, the post card idea was actually yet another brilliant idea by John Darash. He somehow thought that if the judge was barraged with a mountain of postcards that he would recognize the power of "we the people" (more like the 300 or so NLA crazies) and cave to their writ of mandumbazz (even though grand juries can't issue such writs, even if it was real). How many postcards came in, do you know? The NLA gets about 400 or so people on the weekly conference calls, so I am curious how many could be moved to actually send in a postcard. Or was what you posted all of them...a dozen or so? By the way, Darash specifically directed the NLA crazies not to write their return address and use a indecipherable signature so that they couldn't be tracked (they aren't so big on identifying themselves, I WONDER WHY?).

[wserra]

How many postcards came in, do you know?

The clerks collected them in two docket entries, including the one I linked to. That was the larger of the two. Say 15 or so, total.

The NLA gets about 400 or so people on the weekly conference calls, so I am curious how many could be moved to actually send in a postcard.

Not a whole lot, obviously. Hey, it does take 48 cents.

[notorial dissent]

Not to mention carrying out a coordinated action, following directions and copying and printing off the stuff from the supreme dufoos. I suspect those two intelligence tests alone cut a big swath in to the numbers, and then the .48 did the rest of winnowing out the chaff. The one who did it by hand tells a lot by his handwriting, and it ain't pretty.