Dean Clifford - A Tale of Two Gurus

[arayder]

Oh god, the Goodbye post was updated at some point in the last 12 hours to include this gem.

Dean is definitely using all their stuff. he has a drivers license, he has license plates, he has a registered company and yes, he files taxes. how does one get all that if he claims to have rescinded the BC over 3 years ago? I couldn’t get a straight answer from him or any of his mob.

BAHAHAHAHAHA, ALL THIS HEAD SCRATCHING ABOUT HOW DEAN GETS AWAY WITH NOT PAYING TAXES AND HE WAS FILING AND PAYING THE WHOLE TIME?!

I'm cancelling my HBO, this is way better entertainment!

Edit: Actually this info is probably incorrect since we know Dean's license is suspended.

So, maybe, Dean lied to admin about his lie to the freeple?

It's possible that Dean had all his licenses, plates and registrations in order, so he could play the free wheeling, free traveling freeman guru, but got his license suspended because he couldn't manage his temper.

We know that Menard used his SIN to get his father's insurance money and tried to pass off the reversal of freeman practice and theory by telling the thin lie that he merely told the insurance company what his number was before he ripped up the card.

In order to keep their street cred Dean and Bobby have to gen up encounters with the police. Bobby is smart enough to never do anything that's going to land him in jail. . .like his latest Youtube.

But it's possible that Dean just couldn't control himself and crossed the line by assaulting cops, failing to show up in court and daring the cops to bust his grow op. The grow op where they found his illegal firearms.

[Jeffrey]

http://youtu.be/nAkiCI-FYh4

The last video uploaded to the Dean Clifford channel

I like this guy

[JamesVincent]

Edit: Actually this info is probably incorrect since we know Dean's license is suspended.

So, maybe, Dean lied to admin about his lie to the freeple?

It's possible that Dean had all his licenses, plates and registrations in order, so he could play the free wheeling, free traveling freeman guru, but got his license suspended because he couldn't manage his temper.

Much more likely scenario. For him to have had his license suspended meant he would have to have had one to start with. As far as having it suspended it could very well have not paid his fines from an earlier incident (pick one) and it had been suspended for non-payment or a FTA. Any way to find out?

[Jeffrey]

I always assumed it was related to the $50k judgment against him by the Auto Insurance company but now that was apparently a house building accident.

Dean lied to admin about his lie

It's like an onion, so many layers. Dean-ception.

[LightinDarkness]

The "goodbye post" from Deanclifford.info is a priceless insight into how (now ex-) sycophants that follow freeman/sov'run gurus think. Its both hilarious and sad at the same time.

I mean, you didn't have to do much background research on Dean Clifford to know he was lying about much of his claims to "walk the walk" and that he was using the freeman/sov'run stuff to milk idiots out of their money. Of course he would lie, he would say anything to get more people to pay up to join his seminar or pay for his other bogus materials. That its taking his followers thing long to unwind the obvious shows that they care more about wanting to believe the lie than figuring out that freeman magic doesn't work.

The whole Dean Clifford empire was bound to collapse eventually, you can only lie so many times about using freeman tactics to get out of your legal troubles before it comes back to bite you. And once he finally did get arrested in November, he was not able to manage his online image as much as he could before. The slow erosion of time did its work as Dean's followers became bored and wondered just how much he could really offer in terms of freeman magic when he couldn't get himself out of jail...despite trying every freeman incantation in the book.

The house of cards is falling, and I am enjoying sitting back and watching it while eating popcorn.

[Jeffrey]

Welp, they took the update down after about three edits.

Who coulda seen that coming.

[arayder]

Just like you could see coming the desperate attempts of some freemen to explain away the revelations of Dean's greed, poor scholarship and outright lies:

https://worldfreemansociety.org/forum/4 ... mitstart=0

This crew should have been warned by Bill Noble and Trevor Sydorenko, who years ago complained that Dean, who tutored them in the Clifford method, ended up leaving them high and try, unable to defend themselves in open court.

[grixit]

Dean Cliffords Charactor Assination Now Complete!

Apparently Dean's friends have only just noticed that he's a total ass.

[notorial dissent]

Reality must be really hard to ignore, or else Dean just doesn't have as many friends as he'd like to believe. I'd say at this points the inmates, or more precisely, soon to be inmates, are busily fighting amongst themselves.

[arayder]

At the WFS Forum and the Free Dean Clifford Facebook page freeman posters commenting on Dean's situation seem to be breaking out into 3 general categories.

One group of commenters say Dean has done a lot of good for freemen and criticism of him is wrongly aimed solely at his personal live and business failures.

Another group says they don't see evidence of wrongdoing by Dean. When presented with Dean's contradictory statements, deceptions and failures the group goes into "freeman 20 questions" mode asking several questions and endlessly haggling over the responses. Like those in the first group its members sometimes call Dean's critics shills.

A third group is very blunt about Dean's failures and misrepresentations of his past and present efforts. This group goes right down the line documenting Dean's failures and his misrepresentation of them as successes. For their honesty they get some rough treatment by other freemen.

This is the first time in the cycle of a freeman guru's rise and fall that I have seen a group of freemen, like the third group, be so honest and direct about a failed guru's poor scholarship and outright deceptions. The usual practice is to ignore the failed guru and move on.

[JamesVincent]

This is the first time in the cycle of a freeman guru's rise and fall that I have seen a group of freemen, like the third group, be so honest and direct about a failed guru's poor scholarship and outright deceptions. The usual practice is to ignore the failed guru and move on.

Maybe this is part of the end of the cycle period, like Demo was talking about in the other thread.

[Burnaby49]

Well this rant, posted today at the WFS Forum, shows that Dean still has a few supporters. God knows why, the information and documents posted on Quatloos have pretty much totally discredited him. Just an opportunist taking advantage of others by pretending to have the answers when he had nothing but bluster.

What a rats' nest, this thread turned out to be, FFS!
& As much as I agree, with some...
Let he, who is without 'SIN', cast the first stone!
We ALL have our little dark & dirties, with,
None of us, being the epitome of perfection.
SO... let's give credit where it's due, endeavoring to pursue
our birthright, to carry on, doing what we do, with in the Common Law,
ie: DO > NO< HARM.

Otherwise, fill your boots, but, don't judge others.
We're all blazing our own trail through the fodder, & if you can't,
single-handedly, save the planet, shut the f*ck up, and at least do something,
more useful, than kicking someone else, (who's doing the best they can,
with what they've got), in the nuts.
Dean has put his balls on the chopping block, & IMHO, deserves a commendation!

OK... Rant over!

[notorial dissent]

Pretty much for the same reason the dinar scammers are still around. The scammees have so much emotional investment in what the guru has sold them, and what they've sold themselves, that they can't and won't let go of it, even in light of being smacked hard in the face with the obvious scam, in a lot of cases even after the guru has closed up shop or gone on long term vacation to club fed. There are still suckers members of the various prosperity scams of several years ago who are still waiting for them to be resurrected and their packies delivered, even the scammer is dead, in jail, skipped town, moved on to other scams. They simply cannot/will not let go and admit they've been had. I am quite sure that their will be Clifford partisans long after the brothers have moved on to adjoining cells for the remainder of their wasted lives protesting the injustice of it all and their undoubted innocence.

[arayder]

Well this rant, posted today at the WFS Forum, shows that Dean still has a few supporters. God knows why, the information and documents posted on Quatloos have pretty much totally discredited him. Just an opportunist taking advantage of others by pretending to have the answers when he had nothing but bluster.

True to form the Dean apologists are minimizing his deceptions, calling for a still more exact recounting of the Dean debacle and inferring that his WFS critics are shills.

Apparently these boys don't mind being deceived, haven't been paying attention to Dean's history and don't want to hear the truth, no matter what the source.

The plain fact is with a few ruffles and flourishes added on every freeman guru eventually gets around to the same failed central argument. . .the claim that the government, its laws and its courts have no jurisdiction and authority over freemen.

Down deep these poor, deluded boys know that Dean's fall is a simple re-affirmation of the authority of western democracy.

That's why they want to pretend the whole thing is about Dean being kicked, while down, by a few traitorous government sell outs.

And not about how they are just plain wrong!

[arayder]

This is the first time in the cycle of a freeman guru's rise and fall that I have seen a group of freemen, like the third group, be so honest and direct about a failed guru's poor scholarship and outright deceptions. The usual practice is to ignore the failed guru and move on.

Maybe this is part of the end of the cycle period, like Demo was talking about in the other thread.

That makes sense to me.

[Jeffrey]

Did anyone manage to grab the final version of the Goodbye rant?

The version I saved doesn't contain a snippet that is in the final version where "admin" says that Dean wanted him to turn the website into a perpetual money machine.

[Burnaby49]

Did anyone manage to grab the final version of the Goodbye rant?

The version I saved doesn't contain a snippet that is in the final version where "admin" says that Dean wanted him to turn the website into a perpetual money machine.

I have a PDF of the entire thing, a screen shot including the vivid graphics. If you PM me an e-mail address I can send it to you as an attachment. The part that relates to the financial aspects of the website is;

As Dean’s situation deteriorated, this also effected
new signups as numbers continued to dwindle. Many
initially would sign up for $15 per month then quit in
disappointment because they were expecting Dean’s
involvement. Some may have just joined to watch the
few videos that were provided but didn’t want to be a
part of the community.

Now in terms of figures as everyone always has
money on the mind, many assumed there was up to
1200 or so members. Well as it turns out, at the start
there was the option to register for an account without
making a payment. It was determined that many of
the accounts were fake due to automated bots
originating from Russia which somehow managed to
get past the CAPTURA code on the registration form.
About 600 or more were fake which had no access
anyway. Over time, about 300 either quit, stopped
paying or had never paid and were given a free
account. This left about 300 payment members only
and some change.

I cannot take on such burdens and expect to keep
everyone happy and pay off Dean’s private property
he bought. This is not my problem and want nothing
to do with that either.

In reality, Dean does not want to work with but
dictate. He does not want partners and wants
everyone to work for him as slaves and for free.
Technology will not make Dean fulfill his promises or
stop him from stuffing people about.

About 3 months ago, due to so many people wanting
to quit, complaining, and just fed up with all the
issuing of empty promises, losing faith in the whole
incarceration saga numbers continue to dwindle.
Many of these members had actually signed up for
beginner courses also and never got what they paid
for. So at an attempt to keep them around until things
improve, about 66% of these were cancelled but
offered to pay a full year in advance instead. There
was concerned that the wrong type of people would
join also at an attempt to infiltrate and shit all over the
community then leave as there was some shit stirrers
and shills that did not join for the right reasons. It did
not make sense to allow monthly subs were not
working out. There was some new signups that paid
yearly but not enough to sustain things at all. Of
course, testing to see if people would value being
milked and gauged all the time, 99% of the 66%
cancelled recurring payments did not resubscribe to
the yearly offering. I was glad to do this as in good
conscience I did not want to rip people off any further
while so many empty promises remain outstanding
and more promises being issued. This was doomed
for failure from the beginning.

Now that the forum and any current and future
services are no longer available for Dean, all
subscriptions have been cancelled so those who
joined need not worry about being charged for
nothing. I utterly and totally wants nothing to do with
Dean Clifford, his brother or any of their buddies ever
again. It has turned out to be a complete disaster and
so many burdens have been put on me and wishes I
never came on board to do anything at all to begin with.

[Jeffrey]

Oh man we just got the biggest update so far in #12. Don't read the summary if you don't want spoilers.

[*]Dean starts off strong saying he's written to Vladimir Putin asking for help.
[*]A mention is made of a Mr. Galati (?)
I suspect it is this guy
http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2014 ... anges.html

[*]What seems to be an acknowlegement of Admin snapping and needing a break
[*]Dean appears to have been convicted of some of the charges already.
[*]They suggest that the trial for the charges from July will be Friday
[*]Darren makes an incredibly ignorant statement: "if you're found innocent of that then everything else goes away".
[*]One of Dean's recent motions was dismissed and Meads v. Meads was cited.
[*]Dean and Darren predict Dean will be convicted but somehow this is a good thing because "it closes the loop".
[*]Dean is upset that the prosecution is citing case law which compares him to other Freemen that have tried his arguments already.
[*]At some point in the proceedings they've referred to Dean as a leader within the Freeman movement with 30k members. In Dean's mind, this is recognition that he is "head of state of an independent political body.
[*]Dean is backing Kevin Annett's newest project "100%"

[*]Dean threatens to shoot cops dead "the next time"
[*]Clearly heard about Bourque since he adds "I'm surprised more of them aren't dropping dead".
[*]A disturbing insight into the Clifford's mindset when they say that cops are corporations and therefore "cannot fear for their life".
[*]The state put in a huge motion which includes several cases in their entirety including Meads v. Meads (something we should try and grab a copy of).
[*]Dean complains that the rebuttal to his recent motion was too long and therefore a lot of trees were killed in the process.
[*]Dean sued for $50,000 an hour for the last 7 months of being in jail.
[*]The motion refers to Dean's fee schedule as a foisted unilateral agreement.
[*]Dean is hiring a lawyer "just to get out" because his wife is tired of sitting at home alone.

[Hilfskreuzer Möwe]

That's not all. There has been a flurry of activity on the Manitoba Courts website.

In the CR13-01-32571 QUEEN vs CLIFFORD, DEAN C.D. action there is now a bail review hearing set for June 23, 2014 - yes an actually bail hearing, not another of Dean's monotonous something-like-a-habeas corpus applications. Three supporting documents have been filed by Dean: a notice of motion, an affidavit and ... a transcript! Dean is actually daring to allow others to see what he has said in court!?

The transcript is identified in this manner: "PJC, STANNARD, J 25MAR2014".

I assume that means a transcript of a hearing on March 25, 2014, before Judge Stannard in Manitoba Provincial Court.

The other news is that further briefs and amended notices of motion have been filed in action CI14-01-89455 CLIFFORD, DEAN C. vs QUEEN by the defendants. The next hearing on that matter remains July 2, 2014.

(Dean is winning...)

(And don't forget to bring a friend!)

SMS Möwe

[wserra]

[*]Dean and Darren predict Dean will be convicted but somehow this is a good thing because "it closes the loop".

Oh, that loop.