Masonic Fraternal Police Department arrested

[Judge Roy Bean]

The answer:

http://www.hulu.com/watch/1183

[Demosthenes]

And I'm going to say this loud and clear. I'm not a conspiracy theorist.

You should make this your tagline.

[bmxninja357]

And the answer to that is: http://themasonicblog.blogspot.ca/2009/ ... s.html?m=1

Peace.
ninj

[Demosthenes]

Thanks for the viewpoint demo. And I agree that much takes place on the links. No one to listen in. I'm sure we could speculate on that for days.

Feel free to speculate on it all you want. I won't bother, because focusing on the surveillance aspect of why powerful people golf is really really ... um ... incorrect.

[bmxninja357]

It's one aspect but there are many others. I prefer watching caddyshack to playing golf myself.

Peace.
ninj

[The Observer]

Feel free to speculate on it all you want. I won't bother, because focusing on the surveillance aspect of why powerful people golf is really really ... um ... incorrect.

Exactly. Because anyone in the know understands the real power plays are made in donut shops.

[Judge Roy Bean]

Feel free to speculate on it all you want. I won't bother, because focusing on the surveillance aspect of why powerful people golf is really really ... um ... incorrect.

Exactly. Because anyone in the know understands the real power plays are made in donut shops.

Actually, no.

Real power plays are made on golf courses ... but only after arriving in private jets.

Anything involving mere ground transportation alone doesn't make it.

[Demosthenes]

Exactly. Because anyone in the know understands the real power plays are made in donut shops.

Shhhh. That's why I changed my avatar.

The Illuminati is hiding behind the Dunkin' Donuts shell corporation.

[Demosthenes]

Feel free to speculate on it all you want. I won't bother, because focusing on the surveillance aspect of why powerful people golf is really really ... um ... incorrect.

Exactly. Because anyone in the know understands the real power plays are made in donut shops.

Actually, no.

Real power plays are made on golf courses ... but only after arriving in private jets.

Anything involving mere ground transportation alone doesn't make it.

And the power players are often seen engaging in the satanic ritualistic destruction of Cuban cigars and single malt.

[Hyrion]

As I said I have also seen some patches at flea markets. It's more an oddity that there would be so many different ones.

Back in 1988 I was introduced to my first computerized stitching unit. It was in a rather large mall - West Edmonton Mall to be exact - and was being used to sell t-shirts, badges, ball-caps, etc. A lot of tourists visting Edmonton for the first time make their way to the Mall.

You provided them with an image and they can set up the device to create the item.

It's no oddity to myself that there would be so many different ones when you have a single-point tourist trap in place that sells such curiosities.... especially when the tourist could have it tailored within a couple mins to represent their own home town.

I've received plenty of gifts from family and friends who've gone on vacations - some of which I kept over the years, others of which I've gotten rid of. Is it really a surprise to you that such curiosities end up at flea markets?

[Hyrion]

It is also clear that dishonorable actions have came from certain members of masonry.

You keep saying this but have yet to provide actual proof from a reliable source to support the position. And no, I don't view supermarket tabloid articles like the ones produced in "The Independent" as reliable.

When you say "have came from certain members of masonry" I understand that to mean "legitimate members" not "the ones that are pretending to be". If you actually intend to mean "the ones that are pretending to be" you should definitely make that clear in your authorings.

So, I ask you to provide actual proof, verifiable from a reliable source, that a single mason member has committed a dishonorable act.

[bmxninja357]

So have you actually made any such police patches yourself? Not that it matters as they were just an interesting find that seems to be nothing but a oddity or curiosity.

As to the propaganda due lodge and leaked police reports I have found no evidence disproving my findings. Do you even try and find any? I would accept it if it's conformable and reliable.

And if you really belive any group with large numbers has no bad apples you would be wrong. And the greater the numbers the greater the probability.

And as I have sad; I am not for nor against freemasons. This would be the exact same amount of evidence used against other groups or their members on these forums.

Peace
ninj

[Dick Dastardly]

Feel free to speculate on it all you want. I won't bother, because focusing on the surveillance aspect of why powerful people golf is really really ... um ... incorrect.

Exactly. Because anyone in the know understands the real power plays are made in donut shops.

Actually, no.

Real power plays are made on golf courses ... but only after arriving in private jets.

Anything involving mere ground transportation alone doesn't make it.

The Canadians would argue: Actually, real power plays are made on the ice.
(cmon Flames)

[Hyrion]

All bolding where I'm quoting you is mine for emphasis.

So have you actually made any such police patches yourself?

No. I'm the type of person that does not purchase memories for purpose of vacation. I don't even take photos of such..... and this is while I own a phone that can easily snap a photo and I don't have to carry around a camera.

If I were to purchase/get-created such a patch, it would be to serve a purpose such as putting together a halloween costume. And I wear my costumes till they fall apart, I've never sold anything I own in a garage sale or at a flea market.

As to the propaganda due lodge and leaked police reports I have found no evidence disproving my findings. Do you even try and find any?

I strongly believe in the concept of innocent until proven guilty. If I'm going to look into disproving something, first it must be proven. You have not provided anything from a reliable source. Anyone can manufacture a leaked police report - you know that. And supermarket tabloids are famous for producing sensational stories that have no basis in reality just to sell papers.

I would accept it if it's conformable and reliable.

And yet, you haven't provided any reliable source yourself. I have no desire disprove something with a realiable source that has not been proven with a realiable source in the first place.

And if you really belive any group with large numbers has no bad apples you would be wrong. And the greater the numbers the greater the probability.

Philosophically I agree with you. But I'm not going to go out and deliberately look for those bad apples as you seem intent on doing - not without evidence of something bad actually having occurred in the first place. Far too often and too easily, when such occurs, it becomes a witch hunt persecuting innocents because "someone must be guilty". There is so much wrong with the concept of going out to find the bad guy just because you believe there is a bad guy there.

The best way I heard that expressed was on a movie where an older detective was breaking in a rookie. It goes along the lines:

• Never form an opinion till you've gathered all the evidence. Once you've formed the opinion on who the guilty party is you'll discount all the evidence that proves that individual innocent.

And, as the saying goes:

An extraordinary claim requires extraordinary evidence!

You are the one who has presented some extraordinary claims, it's time for you to present evidence to support those claims.

This would be the exact same amount of evidence used against other groups or their members on these forums.

I'm sorry, but I do not agree with your opinion on that. You are the one saying that:

Fact is masons have a rich history in law enforcement and the judiciary globally.

You have presented a "fact" that you have yet to actually substantiate as fact. Ironically you then stated:

a connection that may or may not exist between masons and law enforcement is the issue

Do you even see the contradiction in your words where you presented a particular concept as "fact" then proceeded to reword it as "may or may not"? But then you write:

Fact is there's a few news stories and such on the subject of freemasons in law enforcement, the legal system, and government. This is not speculation but fact.

So now you're presenting it as "fact" again but two things are clearly notable, you present none of those news stories so the true facts can actually be reviewed - or even whether your sources can be considered reliable.

It is also clear that dishonorable actions have came from certain members of masonry. [snip] It does show that it has been used as a vehicle for criminal and shady activities by a few.

Again, statements of "fact" where you have provided no evidence.

My intent is to separate fact from fiction

Then I humbly suggest you start separating your beliefs (and clearly identify them as such) from what you can actually prove as factual. And when you present something as factual, you provide reliable evidence to support that. I've already identified that I do not rely on supermarket tabloids. I also don't rely on main media because they too readily and easily also do not rely on true investigative journalism. And sources of conspiracy theorist sites should be treated as though nothing they've presented is true, not even if they tell you the Earth orbits around the Sun - my humble opinion.

My laughter earlier when you stated:

This would be the exact same amount of evidence used against other groups or their members on these forums.

is based on the fact that when debunking "theories of law" presented by OPCA type individuals, many other posters on this forum presents links to the Law as posted by the Government and Courts. They provide links to actual Judicial rulings that - when reviewed - support their positions.

In my humble opinion, on a scale of 1 to 10 where 10 is an exact match to the evidence used by most posters (Michael Jameson is an example of the exception to the rule) on the Quatloos forum and 1 being no evidence at all - I'd rate the "evidence" you've presented as a 1.2 - in most cases you have provided zero evidence and the few you did should never be considered remotely reliable. And you'll need a much higher level to convince me that the "facts" you are presenting are actual facts.

[davids]

Exactly. Because anyone in the know understands the real power plays are made in donut shops.

Shhhh. That's why I changed my avatar.

The Illuminati is hiding behind the Dunkin' Donuts shell corporation.

Where can I get a Donut Police patch? I so want one. Really, really badly

[bmxninja357]

It's good of you to re context my posts and cherry pick. It's even better that instead of disproving anything you post the equivalent of 'no you'. Why do you not go to the links from the actual freemason sites that I put up. Or are those not real enough for you?

In one at the bottom of the page you will find prince the search dog. Search it yourself.

Ninj

[Hyrion]

It's even better that instead of disproving anything you post the equivalent of 'no you'.

Let's see... you claimed there's wrong-doing going on but you refuse to provide any actual proof.

It would be a simple matter for you to point to a single criminal conviction where the individual was actually a Mason (rather than a pretend-mason). Meanwhile, in order to confirm or disprove the "fact" that "a single Mason has done wrong", I'd have to go through every criminal record of every human on the planet (or at least in those Countries where Masons exist) and try and link at least one individual to being a real Mason.

Your refusal to point to a specific point (of a reliable source) of wrong-doing is telling. The fact that you actually seem to require me to go through magnitudes greater effort to prove or disprove your position when you haven't actually identified anything specific is also telling.

I've seen this tactic before by a plaintiff and the Magistrate was not pleased with the plaintiff. In the SCO vs IBM case over copyrights:

Certainly if an individual was stopped and accused of shoplifting after walking out of Neiman Marcus they would expect to be eventually told what they allegedly stole. It would be absurd for an officer to tell the accused that "you know what you stole I'm not telling." Or, to simply hand the accused individual a catalog of Neiman Marcus' entire inventory and say "its in there somehwere, you figure it out."

The quote is in page 34 of the http://www.groklaw.net/pdf/IBM-718.pdf ruling. The context of the quote should be crystal clear but let me spell it out:

• You are making accusations of wrong-doing. It is up to you to provide sufficient evidence to support those accusations - not others.

Why do you not go to the links from the actual freemason sites that I put up.

I did, most of those are of the conspiracy theorist type. And as you yourself indicated - you don't expect the real site to post anything that would harm their reputation so I'd obviously find nothing there. There is an unproven assumption on my part that one of the links is actually genuine - but I may be giving you too much of the benefit of doubt.

As a result I conclude that your reliability when presenting facts is no better then those presented by other conspiracy theorists. In the future when you state:

it is a fact

I will automatically interpret that to mean:

I believe it is a fact

The only thing that is clear is that I can't take your word for anything because you are not willing to support your position even on claims of wrong-doing.

[bmxninja357]

http://www.masonicinfo.com/p2_lodge.htm

Took about 5 seconds of research at a rest stop to find that. Same as it would take about that long to find sources for my other claims.

But I'm on my phone at work so I guess I will have to do it later.

Ninj

[Demosthenes]

Exactly. Because anyone in the know understands the real power plays are made in donut shops.

Shhhh. That's why I changed my avatar.

The Illuminati is hiding behind the Dunkin' Donuts shell corporation.

Where can I get a Donut Police patch? I so want one. Really, really badly

http://www.amazon.com/Patch-Protect-Emb ... nut+police

[Gregg]

Exactly. Because anyone in the know understands the real power plays are made in donut shops.

Shhhh. That's why I changed my avatar.

The Illuminati is hiding behind the Dunkin' Donuts shell corporation.

Where can I get a Donut Police patch? I so want one. Really, really badly

Of course, we'll be needing a soul for that....