Peter of England: A REal guru.

[PeanutGallery]

LeTissier, I am sorry that you are upset with Wangle's comments. I would say that a lot of what Wangle has posted up has an assessment of Ceylon seems to be ignorant of the view that GOODF is more than a one man band and its not expressly Ceylon's site.

GOODF isn't Ceylon's site, Jon Witterick is supposed to be the one running it (though he keeps in the background), Ceylon does however wield a great deal of influence and this seems to be growing. I don't doubt that you genuinely believe to have been helped and I consider it a genuine possibility that you were in fact helped to deal with whatever hardship life had thrown at you if not in what I would consider a practical sense, then certainly in what you might at the time have considered to be a psychological and supportive sense, you perceived that you were being helped and therefore were helped.

Their is nothing wrong with a person getting into hardship, it happens to all of us, their is equally nothing wrong with looking for help. Their is however something I feel wrong with a site that purports to help, but includes a great many pieces of advice that ultimately will hinder and in some circumstances will lead to greater hardship than otherwise would have been experienced.

Firstly I believe that the vast majority of people posting on GOODF are doing so with good, albeit misguided (and some dangerously so) intentions they want to help, but don't really know the best ways to help. However others and this number seems to be in the ascendancy are posting with a view that debt and financial hardship is a matter of politics and trying to thrust themselves forward as a guru of sorts. For all the people with genuine knowledge I would say the danger is that now they are being shouted down by those who have agendas and axes to grind. The latter group advocate and endorse scams like WeRe bank or philosophy's relating to losing the name.

My other issue with Goodf, and this may apply to the help you received (equally it may not, I don't know the specifics and I do not need to know them) is that GOODF posts up matters as being a success, when they don't know the reasoning behind the success. It could be that the creditor has simply written the debt off because the costs of enforcing it would outweigh what could realistically be returned. A large amount of debt is written off each year and it may not be because the three letters worked, but simply because the creditor wrote the debt off and left a marker on a file. Of course the debtor isn't told this and may think that the letters have worked, when the truth is that they may have had the same level of success by not sending the letters out.

However at the same time this isn't a site where people come for financial advice or dealing with debt we simply report and discuss individuals who we think are trying to take advantage of others or promote a scam. That is what is happening on GOODF at the moment. Ceylon is very heavily promoting Peter of England and his bank and I think this is wrongful behaviour. Ceylon has promoted a great many other scams and personally I don't trust him.

[Hercule Parrot]

I guess this will be another forum I leave for being made to feel uncomfortable.

That would be a great loss to us. Your knowledge and perspective is unique, and I enjoy your comments. Please don't go. And that applies also just as much to wanglepin, who is also a very valuable contributor. Our diversity is our strength.

[Bones]

Whilst this is not the Ceylon thread, I feel that it should be said that Ceylon might have had all the best intentions in the world many years ago. However, now he is a self serving fool that is willing to mislead and lie to those that trust him, for his own benefit.

He seems all to keen these days to promote people like PoE and Bali man who want to charge people for their help. It would come as no surprise to me to learn that Ceylon receives money from these people.

We have the complete lemon that was Tom Crawford - just look at the videos Ceylon made claiming victory. Hell just look at the other claims of success posted by Ceylon and the down right racist post he allows on GOODF.

Whilst I can understand lt14 being grateful for something that ceylon may have done for him in the past, this is not about the past, this is about today and tomorrow and how willing Ceylon is to promote himself at the cost of others.

Let's not paint Wanglepin as the bad guy here people - lets keep the focus on Ceylon and the real damage that the little egotistical hitler is doing to peoples lives

[Losleones]

Bones..... If you don't get a mention in the next Kak & Mac nonsensical garbo I'll pay Tom's mortgage off myself (Re currency of course)

[PeanutGallery]

Let's not paint Wanglepin as the bad guy here people - lets keep the focus on Ceylon and the real damage that the little egotistical hitler is doing to peoples lives

This is true and I do agree. We should try not to infight and argue, however I will say that the strength of this forum is in it's contributors and in basing our opinion on facts and allowing those facts to be disagreed with and discussed.

Ceylon has so far cost a lot of his followers £35 for nothing, helped to lose Tom Crawford his house and rack up fees and at each juncture has washed his hands of failures and will soon find another victim.

[Bones]

Bones..... If you don't get a mention in the next Kak & Mac nonsensical garbo I'll pay Tom's mortgage off myself (Re currency of course)

I forgot to say, Ceylon's need to continually promote himself and act like the big man on GOODF, are clearly signs of someone that is suffering from a small wiener complex and is trying too hard to over compensate for it.

[notorial dissent]

You can't really fault PoE too much, well anyway, by his definition the funds have cleared, a ledger entry was made and the amount of the check was removed from the customer's account at WeRe. The problem is that his magicked up definition isn't the real one, and since no funds have changed hands between his bank and the presenting bank nothing REAL has happened.

letissier14, without knowing, and right off the top it really is none of my/our business, what your problem was or what Ceylon did to help you, I am in no position to judge or comment on that, and won't. I will even go so far as to say that I am glad that whatever your particular experience with Ceylon and GOODF was positive and helpful. I really am.

You obviously have some misgivings or concerns with the way GOODF is going and what is happening there, or you wouldn't have quit. Again, I don't know your reasons or perspective, but I will assume they are sufficient unto yourself.

What you have to see, or at least I certainly hope that you see is that PoE is actively intentionally hurting people, people I assume you once thought of as friends or whatever term you prefer. I realize that most/many of them are in very bad financial situations or have serious problems. What PoE is doing with his not so little swindle, and make no mistake, that is exactly and precisely what it is, is hurting, robbing these people your friends. He is taking money from people who can ill afford it, he is encouraging them to actively, intentionally commit a crime, yes, writing a false check is a crime, and a potentially very serious one. When they end up in court, the prosecutor, and the court, isn't going to care that they thought that for their £10 or whatever that they had magicked up some absurd amount of money and could pay their bills with it. It doesn't work that way. All they will see is someone writing fake checks who knew or should have known they were fake, and I doubt very seriously they will get ANY mercy at all when it comes time to sentencing, and then their lives really will be trashed. They are going to permanently screw up what little credit they have, they will accumulate return fees from the various banks, and late free, or worse, from the entities they gave the checks to. And they will still owe whatever it was they wrote the check for. If the check was sufficiently large, then they will be up for aggravated circumstances which will just add to the ultimate pain they will face. Such a kindness PoE has done for all his GOODF friends and followers.

So, letissier14, just what do you think of your good buddy PoE?

Now we move on to the next aspect. Ceylon. Ceylon is, or at least was, actively supporting and enabling PoE with his not so little scam. The fact that he, and his minions, at your old board have done everything in their power to stifle any dissension in the ranks speaks volumes.

So, let me complete the thought here. Ceylon is/was actively helping PoE to actually physically hurt your former friends and compatriots at GOODF. Now to me that suggests a number of things, and since I am viewing this from far across the pond I have no axes to grind or preconceptions, I just take them as I see them, and judge by actions and acts.

So then, just where does that leave Ceylon?

[littleFred]

Look, I can see how it has happened, but if a post is about Ceylon and nothing to do with PoE, please PLEASE put it in Ceylon's thread.

(I hope that letissier14 continues to contribute here.)

[Bones]

So then, just where does that leave Ceylon?

Really hoping, in prison at shower time, dropping the soap and standing next to someone called Bubba

[letissier14]

So, letissier14, just what do you think of your good buddy PoE?

PoE ....... My good buddy?

You've obviously not read my posts on GOODF condemning the whole weRe Bank fraud then?

[Jeffrey]

Could it be that Peter saw Wolf of Wall Street and assumed that if he does some white collar crime, he'll be sent to some prison/resort with tennis ball courts, saunas and massages?

[Losleones]

So then, just where does that leave Ceylon?

Really hoping, in prison at shower time, dropping the soap and standing next to someone called Bubba

He won't need to as will be accompanied by tatted slapper

[letissier14]

Firstly I believe that the vast majority of people posting on GOODF are doing so with good, albeit misguided (and some dangerously so) intentions they want to help, but don't really know the best ways to help. However others and this number seems to be in the ascendancy are posting with a view that debt and financial hardship is a matter of politics and trying to thrust themselves forward as a guru of sorts. For all the people with genuine knowledge I would say the danger is that now they are being shouted down by those who have agendas and axes to grind. The latter group advocate and endorse scams like WeRe bank or philosophy's relating to losing the name.

My other issue with Goodf, and this may apply to the help you received (equally it may not, I don't know the specifics and I do not need to know them) is that GOODF posts up matters as being a success, when they don't know the reasoning behind the success. It could be that the creditor has simply written the debt off because the costs of enforcing it would outweigh what could realistically be returned. A large amount of debt is written off each year and it may not be because the three letters worked, but simply because the creditor wrote the debt off and left a marker on a file. Of course the debtor isn't told this and may think that the letters have worked, when the truth is that they may have had the same level of success by not sending the letters out.

However at the same time this isn't a site where people come for financial advice or dealing with debt we simply report and discuss individuals who we think are trying to take advantage of others or promote a scam. That is what is happening on GOODF at the moment. Ceylon is very heavily promoting Peter of England and his bank and I think this is wrongful behaviour. Ceylon has promoted a great many other scams and personally I don't trust him.

The thing is, how do you define success?

To you it may be having a debt wiped out, to others it is getting debt collectors off their backs and giving them breathing space. There are so many levels of success.

When I first started using GOODF it was because I had no where to turn to! I had tried, in fact I had actually begged debt collectors to accept my monthly payments, payments that would leave me with nothing, but payments I offered nonetheless just to get them off my back and in every single case they rejected them and hounded me day and night by phone, threatening court action or bankruptcy. They even contacted my family members.

Yes, I used the template 3 letters, and whether it was because they simply decided to write off my account or because of the 3 letters, I didn't really care at the time as I honestly nothing to lose. Within a few weeks a few accounts had been closed and I really can't put into words the relief I felt at that time. A massive weight really had been lifted from my shoulders.

As time went on I deviated from the 3 letters and created my own letters, asking for proof of their claim. And the more I learnt the more confident I got. Not only did I clear all my debts with the Debt Collection Agencies, but I have also managed to remove 11 defaults from my credit file by using the Data Protection Act.

I read as much as I could and started helping on GOODF and I helped other people from going bankrupt, clear their debts and help remove defaults and ccj's from their credit files. These were people who are in debt because of circumstances and not because they simply refused to pay, as I am totally against that.

In my experience, Debt Collection Agencies don't play fairly, they don't follow the rules, and they hound and harass people. I am all for paying ones debts just as long as the company in question are entitled to collect them. Anyway that's my thoughts on that .....

As for the Tom Crawford case, I was one of the first people to question that he had won and said that on their eviction facebook page. I was then abused with private messages and threatened. I had seen the actual judgment on the day as I was given a copy by the media.

PoE - I have called PoE a scam artist and his dodgy weRe Bank, and have posted that on GOODF as well as different Facebook sites, I had many of my posts on this subject deleted on GOODF

If people want to have a pop at me that's fine, but please just don't assume as to what I am about without speaking to me first. I think that is only fair!

[wanglepin]

I think the trouble with you is that you have such a hatred for Ceylon

No more than I do any conman who feeds of the backs of the unfortunate, desperate and disenfranchised of our society.

that you cast everyone who has had anything to do with Ceylon as the same as him.

Not very one letissier14. , just those who are or were in a position to, but fail to challenge or turn a blind eye to all the lies and deceit when it suites them.

Once you get past all the rubbish on GOODF, there are some great people who are quite knowledgeable and have helped many people.

Yes well, I am pleased you mentioned “some great people” because from my own experience good honest posters don’t seem to last too long in goofsville and that is the very difficult part of being an good honest member and one of the “great people” in goofsville. This is why it is also difficult to see when a good honest poster on that forum actually posts, which only leaves the not so “great people” posting lies and deceit.
It is only been recently and for obvious reasons that some posters (out of sheer embarrassment concerning Crawford and Pof E’s Bank) have finally had the balls to actually state where they stand. But how many were banned before those longstanding goof members “woke up” to the embarrassment it was causing them?. I am also totally convinced if it were not for Quatloos and its excellent researchers and posters that no one outside of both these cases would have seen through Crawford’s lies or P of E’s con bank, which would mean more easy pickings (dupes) for Ceylon et al because anyone not directly involved would have been any the wiser. I.E more people would have been going down the Crawford route of defending a complete lost cause and recommending P of E’s bank to the gullible people, less well off and those in serious debt.
While all the time, off the back of it all, Mark Haining Ceylon and Witterick would be raking it in giving £10/£20 talks around the country “explaining” how they and getoutofmoredebtfree had helped save a cancer suffering pensioner from having his home "stolen" by the bank and promoting WeRe bank con along the way and no doubt on commission.

[notorial dissent]

So, letissier14, just what do you think of your good buddy PoE?

PoE ....... My good buddy?

You've obviously not read my posts on GOODF condemning the whole weRe Bank fraud then?

I see sarcasm is a lost lost point here, oh well.

You obviously didn't answer any of my real questions, which was the whole point of the exercise to begin with.

[FatGambit]

that you cast everyone who has had anything to do with Ceylon as the same as him.

Not very one letissier14. , just those who are or were in a position to, but fail to challenge or turn a blind eye to all the lies and deceit when it suites them.

Sorry to butt in but it's quiet hard to challenge a persons views when they delete all your posts moments after you post them.

Both Letissier and dare I say it Ceylon were very helpful to me in the past too, but for some reason Ceylon has lost sight of the core principle of the site he seemed to work so hard on establishing, it's unfair to cast blame for that onto Letissier considering every time he tried to speak up, Ceylon (or someone else) deleted his posts, that one 'WeRe rent' thread went from 5 pages to 2 in the space of 5 minutes and most of the posts deleted were Letissiers.

[wanglepin]

Both Letissier and dare I say it Ceylon were very helpful to me in the past too, but for some reason Ceylon has lost sight of the core principle of the site he seemed to work so hard on establishing, it's unfair to cast blame for that onto Letissier

I think you may have missed this part of my post FatGambit.

But how many were banned before those longstanding goof members “woke up” to the embarrassment it was causing them.

i.e. before the Crawford and WeRe bank became so controversial thereby attracting embarrassment. There were other threads before these particular two and still are..
I too wouldn’t like to see Letissier or yourself go. And believe both of you would be a loss to this forum.
I would like to leave this here now as my comment has caused some disruption.

[FatGambit]

I thought that bit was referring to the likes of smilingalltheway, zark and mareo, sorry.

I can't remember who banned you, does the system ever tell you who it was? Or does it just say 'you're banned', I must admit I've never been banned from a forum before LOL.

[PeanutGallery]

The thing is, how do you define success?

That is a very valid point. I would say that the metric of a success is the ability to repeat the process with an assurance of the same result. People don't get that with the letters, they don't work in some situations, so while I'm not disputing that you have had success in the past, jit may well be that the reason for your success may not be what you have attributed it to.

I recall an episode of the Simpsons, where Homer is trapped inside his house by a bear, after the bear is subdued and relocated back to the woods, Homer petitions up the citizenry to campaign for a bear patrol to keep bears away.

Homer claims the lack of bears is because of the bear patrol and has this exchange with his daughter, Lisa: http://www.critthink2.org/2011/05/23/li ... reasoning/

Their is a marked difference between thinking that a thing has worked and understanding both how and why it has worked or even if it has actually worked at all.

[slowsmile]

It is interesting that Peter has seemingly been absent from any postings for quite some time now. He hasn't confirmed that any meetings have been cancelled and seems to have vanished from public view.

Is it possible that he's on the run?

He'll be up in the Welsh Mountains busy panning for ReGold for his new "gold backed currency" - although I have an inkling that iron pyrites might be more valuable.

Not sure if he's on the lam but I do think he restricts his movements by campervan to avoid ANPR cameras.