Random Freemanesque Babblings from idiots unable to sustain their own thread

[ArthurWankspittle]

Splendid advice from "teddy".

http://www.getoutofdebtfree.org/forum/v ... 6SMPeMkrcs

Yep, go to Police station and end up being charged with wasting police time looks a great plan.

[Firthy2002]

Teddy rightly slapped down by flyingfish (will probably get banned for common sense), from all accounts fannying about is not the done thing in these types of situation.

[Skeleton]

Splendid advice from "teddy".

http://www.getoutofdebtfree.org/forum/v ... 6SMPeMkrcs

Yep, go to Police station and end up being charged with wasting police time looks a great plan.

What a little ball bag, another freeloader that thinks its ok to dodge paying for things that then pushes the price up for everyone else, then cries like a little girl when he gets caught. Obviously he knew he was involved in fare dodging, they caught him and informed him and it then went to court. He has then done the freetard dance of shoving his head up his arse and ignoring the fine. Squeal piggy scream, another that deserves all that is coming to him.

[notorial dissent]

But. but. but. he's a poor starving student, for how long one wonders?

[longdog]

Splendid advice from "teddy".

http://www.getoutofdebtfree.org/forum/v ... 6SMPeMkrcs

Yep... He's a one isn't he?

The OP, if taken at face value, has a perfectly legitimate case and people are telling him/her how to deal with it in a mature, sensible and legally valid way and then that silly fucker comes along and tells them a load of bollocks which will get them jailed. Marvellous... Truly marvellous.

[longdog]

Obviously he knew he was involved in fare dodging, they caught him and informed him and it then went to court. He has then done the freetard dance of shoving his head up his arse and ignoring the fine. Squeal piggy scream, another that deserves all that is coming to him.

Not necessarily... I have vague recollections of people using season tickets and / or an Oyster card being charged with fare dodging because they didn't swipe in or out correctly or couldn't because the barriers weren't working.

Around this part of the country there's also the issue of there being no ticket machines at some stations and trains without ticket sellers/inspectors/guards/whatever they are calling them this week. If you happen to experience that and they have ticket inspectors at the gates (which is rare in Hull but it does happen) you're left arguing your case with an officious prick who refuses to even go and see if there's a ticket seller on the train as happened to me once. I ended up waiting for him to summon BTP before I gave my name and address and the cop went to confirm the absence of ticket seller... I believe the cop's description of the barrier man was "a lazy fucker"

[Burnaby49]

Here in Vancouver the New Westminster Skytrain Station used to have the ticket machines, the only place you could buy a ticket at the station, inside the fare paid zone that you were required to have a ticket to enter.

[FatGambit]

Not read the story/thread but is the one where the guy was done for faredodging because his station didn't have a ticket barrier and the system was programmed that when you scanned out at your destination if there was no entry point scan it only charged you the London travelcard rate (which was substsntially cheaper than his journey fare)?

The guy argued it was not his responsibility to ensure the system didn't have a loophole in but he lost because the Judge said as soon as he realised he should have informed his rail operator.

Edit: read it now, it's unrelated, this is why I can't be bothered with GOODF, you give proper decent advice then some moron comes along and says don't listen to these shills, here's how to get yourself in deeper shit in 3 steps.

[Burnaby49]

Not read the story/thread but is the one where the guy was done for faredodging because his station didn't have a ticket barrier and the system was programmed that when you scanned out at your destination if there was no entry point scan it only charged you the London travelcard rate (which was substsntially cheaper than his journey fare)?

The guy argued it was not his responsibility to ensure the system didn't have a loophole in but he lost because the Judge said as soon as he realised he should have informed his rail operator.

Edit: read it now, it's unrelated, this is why I can't be bothered with GOODF, you give proper decent advice then some moron comes along and says don't listen to these shills, here's how to get yourself in deeper shit in 3 steps.

Our new Skytrain fare system works the other way. We now have the equivalent of Oyster cards. It costs me $1.75 to take single trip within my zone. I'm charged $3.75 if I cross all three zones.

When I scan in at my station I have the $3.75 maximum fare immediately deducted from my card. If I scan out within the same zone it refunds me $2.00 but if I forget to scan out it keeps the whole $3.75. So, unlike your example, if I don't scan out I'm penalized, not rewarded.

[FatGambit]

Yeah the case i was talking about was the oppersite way, the guy was entering the Oyster system from somewhere down Burgess Hill/Brighton way, and his station was so little used it was one of the last to have the electronic barriers installed, so he went for over a year doing a £75 fare for £15 every day, I believe he was only caught because when they installed the barriers his usage spiked and somebody randomly noticed it and started looking closer, he wasn't caught because they were looking for him. Or something to that effect.

I think they've fixed the system in that every station now has the barriers, but i guess if you were thast way inclined, it could still be done. Our local station is such that if the ticket seller isn't in his stall and nobody is about, vaulting the barrier is easy.

[Burnaby49]

Vaulting barriers is easy on Vancouver Skytrain if you are agile, they are about waist high. But not much of a reward for it since fares are relatively cheap. I've seen people go through open faregates without paying but not actually leaping over them.

[Forsyth]

Vaulting barriers is easy on Vancouver Skytrain if you are agile, they are about waist high. But not much of a reward for it since fares are relatively cheap. I've seen people go through open faregates without paying but not actually leaping over them.

Claiming to have travelled from a station with a barrier is one of the ways ticket inspectors identify fare dodgers here. When unable to produce a ticket many people claim to have boarded the train at a nearby station in the hope of being asked to pay for a cheaper ticket than the one they should have purchased initially. If the station they claim to have started from has barriers, however, then this can be used as proof that they didn't really come from there and are attempting to short-fare as they would have been unable to board a train without a ticket in that situation. If a station has barriers that are active then they will also be staffed (stations that are staffed part-time would have barriers that are left open during unstaffed hours). Unsurprisingly, ticket inspectors often have an encyclopaedic knowledge, not only of which stations have barriers, but also of which have manual ticket inspections at which times or on which days, paying particular attention to when these are one-off events as being most likely to catch out the regular fare dodgers.

This incident is interesting as there are two basic scenarios that are likely. One is that the poster had failed to produce a ticket when requested and subsequently gave their details to the ticket inspector. This is not something that can easily be forgotten. If this happened, then attempting to overturn a prosecution on the basis that you didn't receive the summons sent to the address that you gave is unlikely to elicit a favourable response. The other possibility is that someone else gave their name and address. While it is possible, ticket inspectors will usually take steps to verify both identity and address at the time and so is less likely than it may appear at first sight. If this is the case then the advice to the poster should be to both appeal the case AND to obtain the identification evidence from the train company. Most prosecutions are carried out as a result of ticket inspections by Revenue Protection Officers who, while not police officers, are trained in collecting evidence for prosecutions as this is their day-to-day job and should be able to confirm why they believe that the identification is correct.

The penalties for travelling without a ticket in the UK are worth noting. While a passenger without a ticket may be asked to simply buy one on the spot, making an honest mistake can also result in a penalty fare which may be offered at the time or later by post. Many people refuse to pay this on the basis that they didn't mean to fare dodge and expect to just pay the normal (or even discounted) fare, however the purpose of the penalty fare is to focus peoples' minds on remembering to buy a ticket and to check their route and not to imply dishonesty. If a penalty fare isn't offered or, bizarrely but commonly, is offered and refused, then the train operator can prosecute under a byelaw that simply requires travellers to be able to produce a valid ticket on demand. This is virtually impossible to defend against, as producing a receipt for the ticket or even the ticket itself later isn't enough - no ticket at the time and you're guilty. This is similar to the penalty fare for an honest mistake but MUCH more expensive. There's a further offence which applies to deliberate fare dodging which (from memory) requires an element of dishonesty to be proven as well and is even more heavily penalised.

Some areas use electronic ticketing (most notably in London), which allows for alternative means of proving fare dodging (and alternative ways of abusing the system as well), but most journeys outside of London are still using older ticketing methods.

[FatGambit]

Most if not all stations now have electronic gates, they're the same as the ones on the Oyster network (London) and most have ticket issuing machines (you just pop your paper ticket in the slot instead of tapping your Oyster card on the top of the gate) we passed some out in the sticks station in Staffordshire last week and they had the exact same machine setup as our local station (Gatwick) just not a member of staff in sight lol.

[jcolvin2]

Not read the story/thread but is the one where the guy was done for faredodging because his station didn't have a ticket barrier and the system was programmed that when you scanned out at your destination if there was no entry point scan it only charged you the London travelcard rate (which was substsntially cheaper than his journey fare)?

The guy argued it was not his responsibility to ensure the system didn't have a loophole in but he lost because the Judge said as soon as he realised he should have informed his rail operator.

Edit: read it now, it's unrelated, this is why I can't be bothered with GOODF, you give proper decent advice then some moron comes along and says don't listen to these shills, here's how to get yourself in deeper shit in 3 steps.

Our new Skytrain fare system works the other way. We now have the equivalent of Oyster cards. It costs me $1.75 to take single trip within my zone. I'm charged $3.75 if I cross all three zones.

When I scan in at my station I have the $3.75 maximum fare immediately deducted from my card. If I scan out within the same zone it refunds me $2.00 but if I forget to scan out it keeps the whole $3.75. So, unlike your example, if I don't scan out I'm penalized, not rewarded.

Seattle's light rail system works the same way. Must be a West Coast thing ...

[longdog]

Most if not all stations now have electronic gates, they're the same as the ones on the Oyster network (London) and most have ticket issuing machines (you just pop your paper ticket in the slot instead of tapping your Oyster card on the top of the gate) we passed some out in the sticks station in Staffordshire last week and they had the exact same machine setup as our local station (Gatwick) just not a member of staff in sight lol.

The line I use most often (Hull to Sheffield) has no barriers at any station, about half are completely unmanned, most are manned only part time, some don't have any ticket machine at all and most of those that do have machines have machines that don't accept cash (when they work at all). Most trains have a ticket seller on board but after 6pm it's in the lap of the gods so a trip from Goole to Hull can easily leave you fare-dodging whether you want to or not.

[Firthy2002]

I like how they think filing a stat dec automagically works every time. And how they think it magically makes the complaint disappear.

http://getoutofdebtfree.org/forum/viewt ... 20#p475642

Finally it should serve as a cautionary tale to get your mail forwarded if you're living away from your usual address and aren't able to pick it up on a regular basis.

[FatGambit]

Most if not all stations now have electronic gates, they're the same as the ones on the Oyster network (London) and most have ticket issuing machines (you just pop your paper ticket in the slot instead of tapping your Oyster card on the top of the gate) we passed some out in the sticks station in Staffordshire last week and they had the exact same machine setup as our local station (Gatwick) just not a member of staff in sight lol.

The line I use most often (Hull to Sheffield) has no barriers at any station, about half are completely unmanned, most are manned only part time, some don't have any ticket machine at all and most of those that do have machines have machines that don't accept cash (when they work at all). Most trains have a ticket seller on board but after 6pm it's in the lap of the gods so a trip from Goole to Hull can easily leave you fare-dodging whether you want to or not.

I thought you lot in the North were all up to date now LOL, wasn't that George Osbourne's pet project?

[Firthy2002]

I thought you lot in the North were all up to date now LOL, wasn't that George Osbourne's pet project?

LOL we only got real time display boards at each station a few years back!
Since barriers would require staff at each station and therefore facilities for those staff, I don't envisage that happening any time soon!

[longdog]

I thought you lot in the North were all up to date now LOL, wasn't that George Osbourne's pet project?

You must be kidding. The signalmen on the Doncaster to Hull line go home at midnight so if you get the last train out of Kings Cross and it gets delayed by more than a few minutes it's a bus from Doncaster.

I can't even go to see gigs in Leeds because the last train out that'll get me home leaves Leeds about 9.30.

[AndyPandy]

I thought you lot in the North were all up to date now LOL, wasn't that George Osbourne's pet project?

You must be kidding. The signalmen on the Doncaster to Hull line go home at midnight so if you get the last train out of Kings Cross and it gets delayed by more than a few minutes it's a bus from Doncaster.

I can't even go to see gigs in Leeds because the last train out that'll get me home leaves Leeds about 9.30.

I once woke up at York Station after a night out in Leeds, problem was I should have got off at Harrogate Had the pay the difference between Harrogate and York and then another ticket back!