Doazic & Lowery talk freeman failure

[arayder]

Here's an interesting YouTube of a conversation between the well know debunker Doazic and Ben Lowery.

Lowery and Doazic review the status of many well know freeman gurus and Lowery talks about how he went from being someone interested in freeman theory to a critic of the movement.

The two also talk about the harmed caused those who have followed the teachings of the several gurus.

In the comments section you can see Karl Lentz chiming in with some choice comments.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUYFDiw1cWg

[wserra]

It was worth a link to the Lentz thread here.

[arayder]

It was worth a link to the Lentz thread here.

Here ya' go. . .viewtopic.php?f=30&t=10467&hilit=Lentz

I didn't realize how busy Karl has been messing up other people's lives.

At one point in the comments to the above YouTube Karl insists that Doazic tell him who has ever been convicted after using the Lentz method. After Doazic gives him a list of seven people Karl goes all haughty and demands an explanation of the straightforward answer.

Karl Lentz: tell me one person who went to jail doing my STUFF, you can't name one case, give one Case #

Doazic: Paul Gratton, Jason Youngstrand, Richard Rodriguez, John Fall, Vanesa Gonzalez, Elias Trevino, Shariati Mahbobeh, etc.

Karl Lentz: Doazic , please explain

[littleFred]

Good discussion, and good comments with Karl Lentz.

On the video, Ben and Doazic discussed the possibility, raised on Quatloos, of Tom Crawford and his wife Sue losing the house that Sue inherited from her mother.

This appears to have been invented by UK Quatloos participants, with no evidence that anyone inherited anything.

[wserra]

In the comments section you can see Karl Lentz chiming in with some choice comments.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUYFDiw1cWg

Things getting interesting over there.

[notorial dissent]

It's really hard to spin being convicted on ALL counts even for an inveterate liar. Particularly when he doesn't control the forum.

[arayder]

In the comments section you can see Karl Lentz chiming in with some choice comments.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUYFDiw1cWg

Things getting interesting over there.

It's really hard to spin being convicted on ALL counts even for an inveterate liar. Particularly when he doesn't control the forum.

Lentz appears to have gone off the rails including claiming that he isn't allowed to post here.

[notorial dissent]

He doesn't like the lack acclimation he gets here, but I don't think he's ever posted more than once or twice at most. No one here is buying what he's selling and he doesn't control the narrative. Otherwise see my comment re: inveterate liar.

[arayder]

He doesn't like the lack acclimation he gets here, but I don't think he's ever posted more than once or twice at most. No one here is buying what he's selling and he doesn't control the narrative. Otherwise see my comment re: inveterate liar.

Most freemen gurus are pretty bad about giving straight answers and arguing the point at hand. But Karl hits a new low by almost immediately calling names and insulting so as to avoid any discussion of his failures.

[notorial dissent]

Lentz doesn't and never did deal in straight answers, just hyperbole, obfuscation and evasion.

[arayder]

Lentz doesn't and never did deal in straight answers, just hyperbole, obfuscation and evasion.

Here's a YouTube of Lentz having a conversation with Doazic, at least I think it's Doazic. Lentz launches into insult mode right away and is so verbally abusive that there is really no conversation going on.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-GW_vorZr8

Lentz insults, split hairs and then sums up his argument by saying his client/friend is in jail only because the powers that be couldn't afford to have a Lentz style truth sayer out on the streets.

[notorial dissent]

I think Lentz has gotten more brittle and desperate as he has gotten older and his mounting history of fail is beginning to catch up with him as his record is now catching up with him. One of the positive things of the innerwebs is that the kind of absolute fail that his method generates gets documented and tossed out in to cyberspace where he can no longer hide from it, and everyone can see it. That and I think the old fool has started believing his own con and it finally caught up with him and will ultimately send him to jail. It must be a bitter thing to know that not only does your fantasy NOT WORK, but that it is sending YOU to jail for not working.

[Jeffrey]

Lentz insults, split hairs and then sums up his argument by saying his client/friend is in jail only because the powers that be couldn't afford to have a Lentz style truth sayer out on the streets.

Actually the Frank in question is his step-father who was sentenced in January (9 months after that audio) for sexually abusing a minor:
http://www.nbc29.com/story/34175435/aug ... ttery-case

Even more interesting, Karls real father was also accused of sexual assault but it's not clear if he was ever charged.

[arayder]

Lentz insults, split hairs and then sums up his argument by saying his client/friend is in jail only because the powers that be couldn't afford to have a Lentz style truth sayer out on the streets.

Actually the Frank in question is his step-father who was sentenced in January (9 months after that audio) for sexually abusing a minor:
http://www.nbc29.com/story/34175435/aug ... ttery-case

Even more interesting, Karls real father was also accused of sexual assault but it's not clear if he was ever charged.

Wow! It's no wonder Karl's got anger management issues.

[notorial dissent]

I think the entire family has some serious issues they are NOT dealing with. Dysfunctional doesn't even begin to describe them.

[arayder]

Freemanary used to be new. Now it's an pair of old, ragged shoes on the feet aging losers and nut cases.

There was a time when the gurus offered a sort of hope to the rank and file freemen. Freemen were told they'd have their own courts, that common law would rule and that their government accounts would pay the bills. Instead they got debt, grinding poverty, heavy fines, jailings and broken families . . .and it's all the fault of guru class. . .the gurus who can't make their theories work in their own lives.

It says a lot that the guru class itself is racked with broken families, criminal convictions, flights from prosecution, failed projects, questionable mental health and bad teeth. Sadly, the prosperity and freedom promised by the guru class has alluded the gurus themselves. After years of failure, deception and fund raising scams the brain trust of freemnary is either discredited, jailed or in hiding.

Freemanary has a pulse the same way your drunk uncle's chest heaves when he passes out on the couch after the thanksgiving meal.