Rekha Patel loses her house

[rumpelstilzchen]

The moderators agreed that we shouldn't keep naming the neighbour, looks like the quotes and a bit of automation have caused the issue. Please refer to "the neighbour".

Ok. Point taken.

[Siegfried Shrink]

I dare say the court people were cagey with names because they did not want Thelma and Louise looking them up in the phone book and coming round to arrest them.

There you are, doing a quiet bit of potting on, or whatever gardeners do on a Sunday afternoon and suddenly some odd people turn up waving phone cameras and performing rituals.
Personally I'd welcome the diversion, and would even fail to begrudge the bucket of liquid manure that might get accidentally spilled over someone's feet but not everyone enjoys the zoo visiting them even when they know the creatures are harmless. If the woo is new to you, the occasion could be downright alarming.

[noblepa]

Given the fact that their liens aren't worth the paper they are printed on I doubt that was the case.

The liens can not be enforced, but they can cause a lot of problems for the victim. If the victim wishes to sell his/her house, it may not be possible until the bogus lien is removed. It can affect their credit rating, making it difficult to get a credit card or buy a car, or force them to pay a higher interest rate than they otherwise would.

[notorial dissent]

I was under the impression that the ONLY way to create what we consider a lien was to go through a court hearing, am I wrong? I didn't think England had any kind of recordation process that could make them public, or a problem for soemone.

[NYGman]

Frances Apples is the bitch from next door who wants the property. She will regret what she is trying to do when she looses her home to legal fees

Good God Ken. Just how much are you charging your client?

But he isn't a lawyer so where on Earth will those fees come from, I can't believe she is hiring real lawyers.

[rumpelstilzchen]

New supporter in the form of Master Bait ..

Robert White
Yes Rekha it is a disgrace, and that is exactly why we should not enter their non courts. I have sent you a message which may help with your case.

Isn't this treasonous behaviour? I was under the impression that PLDers could only assist those people who are standing under Article 61.

[notorial dissent]

Frances Apples is the bitch from next door who wants the property. She will regret what she is trying to do when she looses her home to legal fees

Good God Ken. Just how much are you charging your client?

But he isn't a lawyer so where on Earth will those fees come from, I can't believe she is hiring real lawyers.

Wrecka's too cheap and too stupid for that, and all she'd do is rack up more indebtedness. If she tries to take the neighbor to court the insurance company will eat her alive. Thompson is dumb enough I think he is thinking they can put liens against the neighbor's property for their claims.

[Wakeman52]

But, hang on a minute, this talk of suing the neighbour. Wasn't it Rekha's repeated (losing) attempts to get the original decision and compensation award against her overturned that ran up the fees that, by refusing to pay, she has dug herself into the present situation?

Good luck with finding any legal professional willing to take her situation on, even 'pro-bono'. Oh yes, she could be a 'litigant-in-person' or hire the likes of Ken 'HND' Thompson. After all, those methods have worked so well up to now.

I don't believe the neighbour wants (or has ever wanted) to own Rekha's property, although I have no direct evidence. If I were them, I think I would just like the whole damn mess resolved. ASAP.

[Siegfried Shrink]

I was under the impression that the ONLY way to create what we consider a lien was to go through a court hearing, am I wrong? I didn't think England had any kind of recordation process that could make them public, or a problem for soemone.

You are quite correct, the million pound liens are as chaff in the wind over here, and are scattered with abandon despite being useless. One problem with them is that I doubt if more than a small percentage of the population liened upon have any idea at all what the word means, so it's a pretty airy threat, like 'here's a higswillow to mimble your cleats!'

[Wakeman52]

Thompson is dumb enough I think he is thinking they can put liens against the neighbor's property for their claims.

Generated by Baron David Ward?

[SteveUK]

I was under the impression that the ONLY way to create what we consider a lien was to go through a court hearing, am I wrong? I didn't think England had any kind of recordation process that could make them public, or a problem for soemone.

We have possessional liens, but naturally these aren't what our heroes think them to be.

https://uk.practicallaw.thomsonreuters. ... rue&bhcp=1

[notorial dissent]

I didn't think they knew what they were talking about.

I would suspect that the only thing the neighbor wants is the peaceful enjoyment of her property, her house left alone, and Wrecka to go far far away and LHTHA.

[longdog]

Given the fact that their liens aren't worth the paper they are printed on I doubt that was the case.

The liens can not be enforced, but they can cause a lot of problems for the victim. If the victim wishes to sell his/her house, it may not be possible until the bogus lien is removed. It can affect their credit rating, making it difficult to get a credit card or buy a car, or force them to pay a higher interest rate than they otherwise would.

In the UK there's no means whatsoever of 'registering' one of these 'commercial liens' unless you include a few crank websites only ever visited by cranks or people looking for crank-based amusement.

To affect the sale of a house the crank would have to register their 'lien' (which aren't actually liens at all in UK law in the first place) as a charge on the property with The Land Registry. The Land Registry are going to tell the crank to get stuffed or get a court order which they won't be able to do as the 'lien' is legally worthless shit.

To affect somebody's credit rating they would have to register the 'lien' as a debt with the credit reference agencies who would tell the crank to get stuffed or get a County Court Judgement. The County Court would... You guessed it... Tell the crank to piss off and take their legally bollocks 'lien' with them.

The 'commercial lien' tactic might work or have worked in the US where people can lodge such nonsense at the local courthouse but in the UK there's no direct equivalent. These 'liens' are 100% worthless and completely and utterly unenforceable. They have no legal effect whatsoever except perhaps as evidence against the cranks who created them if the 'victim' decides to launch a civil action for defamation or a criminal action for harassment / demanding money with menaces / fraud and probably quite a few other offences.

[longdog]

I was under the impression that the ONLY way to create what we consider a lien was to go through a court hearing, am I wrong? I didn't think England had any kind of recordation process that could make them public, or a problem for soemone.

You are quite correct, the million pound liens are as chaff in the wind over here, and are scattered with abandon despite being useless. One problem with them is that I doubt if more than a small percentage of the population liened upon have any idea at all what the word means, so it's a pretty airy threat, like 'here's a higswillow to mimble your cleats!'

I was under the impression that a valid lien didn't actually need any interaction with the legal system and it came into existence by circumstance. The classic example being a person who takes a car to be repaired and refuses to pay the bill. In those circumstances the garage has a lien over the car and can retain it until such time as the owner settles the bill. The lien doesn't have to be in writing or 'registered'. Ultimately it will probably take a court order to decide if the garage can eventually sell the car to clear the debt or if the customer can have their car back but the lien doesn't create a debt as these 'commercial liens' for £6,000,000 purport to do.

[TheNewSaint]

If I were the neighbor, I think I would just like the whole damn mess resolved. ASAP.

If i were the neighbor, I'd be hiring a lawyer to prepare a defense for justifiable homicide.

In all seriousness, I've shared buildings with awful people, and my heart goes out to this poor person who's had to put up with years of Rekha Patel's bullshit. They must be undergoing a lot of harrassment.

Which is going to continue, apparently, in the form of phony liens. Issued by the "filmmaker" who showed up at her doorstep demanding she participate in a documentary or be called a racist. With assistance from the lovable "Baron" David Ward down at the homeless shelter. Ugh. My heart goes out.

[The Observer]

I was under the impression that a valid lien didn't actually need any interaction with the legal system and it came into existence by circumstance. The classic example being a person who takes a car to be repaired and refuses to pay the bill. In those circumstances the garage has a lien over the car and can retain it until such time as the owner settles the bill. The lien doesn't have to be in writing or 'registered'. Ultimately it will probably take a court order to decide if the garage can eventually sell the car to clear the debt or if the customer can have their car back but the lien doesn't create a debt as these 'commercial liens' for £6,000,000 purport to do.

The point of recordation of a lien is notify all creditors that there is an legal encumbrance that is establishing priority over other creditors who have not established their priority and to assist in reaching the equity in the assets of the debtor if they are liquidated.

Your example of the car repair is known as a mechanic's lien and does not require a recorded notice since the law establishes the mechanic as having a superpriority over any other creditors, secured or not. This is because the mechanic should be treated fairly in allowing him/her/it to recover the monies for the services they provided in advance. Otherwise mechanics would never repair a car if they were required to record a notice of lien on any work done in advance of payment. The mechanic's lien does not create a debt but establishes that a debt came into existence and was not paid, thus the encumbrance is created under operation of law. This is what the FOTLs/sovruns/TPs never seem to understand, so they spend their time going off on ridiculous tangents thinking that the lien notice must be the lien (it isn't), that it legally orders people to pay them money (it doesn't) and that recording it was a magical moment that corrected all of their legal problems (it didn't).

The lien does require support of the legal system in order to be recognized and supported for the purpose that the law gave it. Thus, in the US, the recordation of a lien typically is given recognition until someone proves that the lien is bogus and they get the lien notice expunged from the records. The UK system is much better in that the lien notice is required to pass inspection before becoming part of the public record, thus sparing people much of the grief that the FOTLS have caused in the US.

[SteveUK]

But be warned , liens ARE a very real thing in U.K law, albeit rare in their named form.

Here's Tanfield Chambers discussing the main rulings for example.

http://www.tanfieldchambers.co.uk/resou ... -what--how

So (1) liens DO exist in the U.K., (2) it's not what the footlers think it is and (3) they haven't got a hope in hell of enforcing their garbage claims.

[aesmith]

But, hang on a minute, this talk of suing the neighbour....

Trying to follow this .. she is in the current position after losing in court to her neighbour, and has been awarded their costs. Now she wants to sue said neighbour for the loss she's suffered as a result of losing said case. Is that it? Can anyone be that bonkers?

[Dr. Caligari]

Can anyone be that bonkers?

If you've been on Quatloos for a while, the answer should be obvious.

[longdog]

The lien does require support of the legal system in order to be recognized and supported for the purpose that the law gave it. Thus, in the US, the recordation of a lien typically is given recognition until someone proves that the lien is bogus and they get the lien notice expunged from the records. The UK system is much better in that the lien notice is required to pass inspection before becoming part of the public record, thus sparing people much of the grief that the FOTLS have caused in the US.

The reason these non-liens will always fail is that passing 'inspection' means getting a court to recognise the 'lien' as being valid in law which will never happen. If anyone were to attempt to enforce one of these 'liens' in court, which they never do of course, the case would be summarily dismissed without a hearing. A defence of "This claim has no legal basis and the 'lien' is pseudolegal gibberish. The case should be struck out for lack of claim" would be more than sufficient for any court. A moderately intelligent dog could win a case against such drivel.

Even if the case were lost due to the respondent's deliberate or inadvertent failure to lodge a defence the 'lien' wouldn't be part of 'the public record' only the judgement.