Robert 'Crab Bait' White consents to losing his houses

[longdog]

Robert White

At last a summons. I could quite easily get out of this by letting them know I've been adjudged as being bankrupt, but I don't like easy I love a challenge. Remember the Ollie Pinnock case where lots of people sent a letter of objection to the court? Well it's time for that again but please wait for the word and I will post a letter for everyone to send when the time is right.

Ah yes... Remember the Ollie Pillock case and forget the 'letters of objection' achieved the sum total of fuck all and he was jailed until his mum paid his council tax bill

[noblepa]

Robert White

At last a summons. I could quite easily get out of this by letting them know I've been adjudged as being bankrupt, but I don't like easy I love a challenge. Remember the Ollie Pinnock case where lots of people sent a letter of objection to the court? Well it's time for that again but please wait for the word and I will post a letter for everyone to send when the time is right.

Ah yes... Remember the Ollie Pillock case and forget the 'letters of objection' achieved the sum total of fuck all and he was jailed until his mum paid his council tax bill

In the US, taxes can not be discharged in bankruptcy. Is this true in the UK, or can a bankrupt person avoid owing tax?

[Firthy2002]

In the US, taxes can not be discharged in bankruptcy. Is this true in the UK, or can a bankrupt person avoid owing tax?

According to CAB, it doesn't get you off the hook for monies owed to HMRC.
He might be able to get out of this CTax though.

[rosy]

Tax and council tax debts can be included in bankruptcy in the UK, up to the date of the bankruptcy (with some complex rules for the current year's council tax).

The debts that can't be included are (in brief): student loans, secured loans (including mortgages), any debt subject to a charging order, any loan obtained fraudulently, child or spousal maintenance, confiscation orders, repayments of benefits if the benefit application was fraudulent, court fines, social fund or crisis loans from the DWP.

[longdog]

Somebody might know better and be able to correct me but I thought it worked like this...

There are some debts that are wiped out by bankruptcy and some that are not but in a case like Crabbie's where it appears he has substantially more assets (his house) than the total debt all creditors will be paid from his assets including the council tax he owes from before and after his bankruptcy. He was after all made bankrupt by Southampton Council specifically for outstanding business rates of 40 grand or so.

If his house is worth £100,000 and the debt he was bankrupted for was £40,000 that leaves a very comfortable margin for the official receiver to pay any other debts. In any event his refusal to cooperate with the OR would mean his outstanding debts will never be written off.

[Firthy2002]

Wouldn't the Council have to inform/be informed by the OR to join the bankruptcy as a creditor though?

[rumpelstilzchen]

All irrelevant.
You are all forgetting that Mr Crab has just been up to Scotland to set up the new common law courts. No doubt the first to be prosecuted for being a very naughty boy will be the OR.
Mr Crab is winning!!!!61!!!!

[longdog]

Wouldn't the Council have to inform/be informed by the OR to join the bankruptcy as a creditor though?

Presumably "How do you stand with your council tax?" is one of the questions the OR asks the bankrupt at the beginning of the bankruptcy but as Master Bait is not cooperating presumably the OR hasn't yet notified them. As far as the council is concerned I assume they are still free to pursue the ordinary proceedings against him.

[ArthurWankspittle]

Wouldn't the Council have to inform/be informed by the OR to join the bankruptcy as a creditor though?

I think the council have to notice it themselves and contact the OR.
Remember how bankruptcy works. At a point in time all the bankrupt's assets and debts are aggregated and disposed of by the OR. It isn't the OR's job to find people, it is their job to tell him. Works both ways. Bank might say this guy has £500 in one of our accounts, creditor might say this guy owes us £1000 for building work. OR is obliged to exclude the excludable and add and subtract the monies.

[notorial dissent]

Since he was made bankrupt FOR having not paid his council tax, wouldn't that make them one of the creditors who need to be paid and kept notified?

[ArthurWankspittle]

Since he was made bankrupt FOR having not paid his council tax, wouldn't that make them one of the creditors who need to be paid and kept notified?

Er yeah. Sorry, forgot where we started from with this one.

[Siegfried Shrink]

Since he was made bankrupt FOR having not paid his council tax, wouldn't that make them one of the creditors who need to be paid and kept notified?

If I recall correctly, the default was business rates, in Southampton. Business rates are a different tax subject, and it was in a different tax jurisdiction. His local authority in the Medway area was not involved.

[notorial dissent]

Ah, didn't realize they were different jurisdictions.

[longdog]

His local authority in the Medway area was not involved.

He's from Sheerness so it would be the Isle of Sheppey sending him the CT bill. The case was heard at Medway court 15 miles up river because Sheerness hasn't got around to building a court yet which is surprising given the innate criminality of its denizens

[notorial dissent]

Has our little quail gotten around to crowing about his successes up north, or is the ringing silence telling?

[HardyW]

If I recall correctly, the default was business rates, in Southampton. Business rates are a different tax subject, and it was in a different tax jurisdiction. His local authority in the Medway area was not involved.

It's not really correct to say "different jurisdictions" are involved, at least not in the American sense: there is one civil court system covering the whole of England. Plus, there's a policy that any money claim against an individual debtor will by default be transferred to the County Court local to the debtor's residence. So Southampton City Council's lawyer has to travel to Kent (or instruct a local lawyer presumably), rather than Mr Bait having to travel to his former home city.

Also there have been many mergers of local court administrations so it's not surprising the case is heard at Medway in the next district to Swale in north Kent.

For anyone who isn't familiar, "business rates" in England is the local council's property tax for business premises and "council tax" the same for residential. The present government is simultaneously squeezing the amount councils get from central government and denying them the ability to increase the rates by more than a token amount. So the councils have more need than ever to collect as much of their income as possible.
His council tax debt is for Swale council which covers Sheppey/Sheerness, and we can't tell how involved they are in the whole bankruptcy process.

[Siegfried Shrink]

I should have been more precise. Your explanation is far more acccurate.

[The Observer]

In the US, taxes can not be discharged in bankruptcy. Is this true in the UK, or can a bankrupt person avoid owing tax?

Certain taxes under certain rules can be discharged in bankruptcy in the US. What makes you think otherwise?

[notorial dissent]

Thanks, makes much more sense now. He's still in the same hole he started out in though.

[AndyPandy]

Thanks, makes much more sense now. He's still in the same hole he started out in though.

Yup, only digging himself even deeper / wider hole by sending out those ridiculous notices. All he's doing is providing the evidence needed for the OR to escalate his bankruptcy proceedings for non cooperation.

He's nothing but a loud mouthed fool.