OPPT (One Person's Public Trial) - Tucci-Jarraf

[Athis]

Thanks for the links Resume

In another recorder conversation I heard BZ say she had tried using the TDA routing numbers scam.
The transactions were reversed (cancelled actually) and the bank terminated her accounts.
She got off lightly.

The scammers always refer to the cancellations as reversals to imply the transactions addressed a real account and had completed; and then were later manually reversed by the Fed. They even imagine there is a special room in the Fed set up just to stop them accessing their accounts. But whenever I saw any of them display the bank notification it said 'cancelled' - not 'reversed'.
Even if a transaction is credited to our account immediately we push the button for a wire or online transaction, the actual transfer of funds takes a few days to go through the banking system. In effect we receive temporary credit.
The TDA transactions dont address real accounts and dont make it through the system to completion and are cancelled - not reversed. I know most of you here know all that - just saying.

[Jeffrey]

Day 4 update is out, prosecution rested and if Heather and Randy don't spend a lot of time, I'm guessing it goes to the jury quickly. Heather apparently played her trump card which seemed to be some sort of argument about the government not presenting any evidence of intent to defraud.

[ArthurWankspittle]

I wondering if Heather is going to end in a blaze of glory, with a closing statement of you're all foreclosed, you have no jurisdiction, etc. etc. which will get slapped down by the judge but allow Heather to claim she was prevented from putting her case, which in turn will keep her five(?) harpies believing.

[TheNewSaint]

Heather apparently played her trump card which seemed to be some sort of argument about the government not presenting any evidence of intent to defraud.

Depending on the form the argument took, that may not be a bad approach. 1956(a)(1)(A) includes the word "intent."

[Siegfried Shrink]

I wondering if Heather is going to end in a blaze of glory, with a closing statement of you're all foreclosed, you have no jurisdiction, etc. etc. which will get slapped down by the judge but allow Heather to claim she was prevented from putting her case, which in turn will keep her five(?) harpies believing.

Such a tactic should save the jury the need to retire, although for forms sake they will no doubt do so.

[Jeffrey]

the term “knowing that the property involved in a financial transaction represents the proceeds of some form of unlawful activity” means that the person knew the property involved in the transaction represented proceeds from some form, though not necessarily which form, of activity that constitutes a felony under State, Federal, or foreign law, regardless of whether or not such activity is specified in paragraph

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/1956#c_7

Seems like there's two legitimate defenses Heather could use to walk free. 1. Claim that she didn't know that the money came from wire fraud, which seems like a hard sell because she was informed that the money was the result of wire fraud. or 2. Claim that the money laundering was not done to "promote the carrying on of specified unlawful activity". They laundered the money to buy a van, a pickup truck and pay off debts, none of those fall under "unlawful acts", and I'm wondering what unlawful act the prosecution is arguing they were trying to promote. Unless they're arguing they were going to use the $1.5 million to promote the TDA scam which might fly.

Per Heather's entourage, the prosecution seems to be using an out of context prison phone conversation as evidence of intent.

[waylonmercy]

They laundered the money to buy a van, a pickup truck...

No, the vehicles were purchased to launder money. If everything had gone according to Heather's plan, the vehicles would have been driven to a big state like Texas and sold at a discount. The next step would have been to take the proceeds from the sales (plus the bills of sale) to a bank and established a business checking account using an employer identification number (EIN). At that point, they would have had no problem moving the money to a bank outside of the United States.

[Gregg]

They laundered the money to buy a van, a pickup truck...

No, the vehicles were purchased to launder money. If everything had gone according to Heather's plan, the vehicles would have been driven to a big state like Texas and sold at a discount. The next step would have been to take the proceeds from the sales (plus the bills of sale) to a bank and established a business checking account using an employer identification number (EIN). At that point, they would have had no problem moving the money to a bank outside of the United States.

There is no evidence to support that theory that I've seen, do you know something or are you just speculating? I really don't think they're that smart, Randy certainly seemed to just be trying to do what he would have done if he had won the lottery.

2. Claim that the money laundering was not done to "promote the carrying on of specified unlawful activity". They laundered the money to buy a van, a pickup truck and pay off debts, none of those fall under "unlawful acts", and I'm wondering what unlawful act the prosecution is arguing they were trying to promote. Unless they're arguing they were going to use the $1.5 million to promote the TDA scam which might fly.

The illegal activity was robbing the bank, which is what they did in the very beginning, when they caused one bank to act on the belief that they would be getting a transfer incoming from another bank. Even if your computer is the only one who fell for it, its still a crime to steal.

[Athis]

I never heard any suggestion from any of them that they intended to expatriate the money Randy got.
I'm not 100% about this, but I have a vague memory or impression from early on that they intended to use the RV to travel around the US spreading the good news and promoting their TDA theories and message of universal salvation.
But I'm not sure about that?

How anyone who gets involved in the TDA thing using their own name and social security number and accounts thinks they could possibly get away with it is difficult to understand. Criminals generally make some effort to hide their actions and identity. Randy did this out in the open with his own identity. A proper criminals use a false ID if they intended to commit wire fraud.
These people really believe the sov myths about birth certs and TDA accounts and all kinds of crazy stuff. For them all that stuff is absolutely real. I think Randy wanted to be able to show others that he had done it, so they could do it too.
I think Randy thinks of his actions as a sort of latter day Boston Tea Party.

[TheNewSaint]

It doesn't matter what they were going to do next. What matters is the fraudulent transfer from the bank, and the attempts to launder it via purchasing and immediately cashing in CDs. Heather tried to get the RV dealer to accept money she knew Randy had acquired in this fashion, which should meet the "intent" requirement.

[Resume]

Anyone else think they're gonna get away with this? Listening to those giggling nitwits and not having the actual transcripts to peruse gives me a funny feeling, especially as to Heather's charge.

[Gregg]

It doesn't matter what they were going to do next. What matters is the fraudulent transfer from the bank, and the attempts to launder it via purchasing and immediately cashing in CDs. Heather tried to get the RV dealer to accept money she knew Randy had acquired in this fashion, which should meet the "intent" requirement.

In the end the RV dealer did accept the money (they had it already when Heather was on the phone, USAA was trying to get it back, but they didn't, it was sent FEDWIRE which really is irreversible). The RV is impounded on behalf of USAA but it is, at this moment, titled in Randy's name. The funny part is, he thinks that next week when he gets out, he's going to go pick it up.

[Gregg]

Anyone else think they're gonna get away with this? Listening to those giggling nitwits and not having the actual transcripts to peruse gives me a funny feeling, especially as to Heather's charge.

i doubt it, the giggling nitwits aren't on the jury.

[Resume]

Anyone else think they're gonna get away with this? Listening to those giggling nitwits and not having the actual transcripts to peruse gives me a funny feeling, especially as to Heather's charge.

i doubt it, the giggling nitwits aren't on the jury.

That's the thing, I can't get a feel for what's really going on without some sort of context aligned with reality.

[Chaos]

now, CDs have a penalty for withdrawing them too early. Surely the bean would have been made aware of this through the bank correct? especially with the numbers we're talking about here. hence, knowledge he had to get that money out before he was caught regardless of paying a pesky fee.

[BoomerSooner17]

Heather apparently played her trump card which seemed to be some sort of argument about the government not presenting any evidence of intent to defraud.

I thought her trump card was Donald Trump personally getting her released.

[TheNewSaint]

Anyone else think they're gonna get away with this?

Heather's only facing one charge of conspiracy, so you never know. But Randy's facing 6 or 7 charges of actually doing the transfers, which should be easy to prove. He's not getting away.

[Chaos]

Heather apparently played her trump card which seemed to be some sort of argument about the government not presenting any evidence of intent to defraud.

I thought her trump card was Donald Trump personally getting her released.

[Athis]

It doesn't matter what they were going to do next. What matters is the fraudulent transfer from the bank, and the attempts to launder it via purchasing and immediately cashing in CDs. Heather tried to get the RV dealer to accept money she knew Randy had acquired in this fashion, which should meet the "intent" requirement.

Thing is, in Heather's mind the money Randy got was rightfully his. Neither of them regarded the money as stolen. They both believed then, and they still believe today, that they did nothing wrong. These people really believe the TDA accounts exist and are rightfully theirs.
I believe they are mistaken and what they did was simply wire fraud by taking advantage of the ACH system and I fully expect that is how the court will see it. But that is not how they see it.
I dont agree with their beliefs and their point of view, but I'm able to see things from their perspective to some extent.
I find their bizarre beliefs and psychology fascinating; that's why I'm following the case.

[TheNewSaint]

Thing is, in Heather's mind the money Randy got was rightfully his.

In Heather's mind, she's going to secret meetings in Antarctica with the Rothschilds, Xi Jinping, Vladimir Putin, various royal families and American presidents, and Janet Yellen.

Heather's mind may not be the best thing to go by.