confused capacities & agreements

If a word salad post claims that we need not pay taxes, it goes in the appropriate TP forum. If its author claims that laws don't apply to him/her, it goes in the appropriate Sov forum. Only otherwise unclassifiable word salad goes here.
parzival
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by parzival »

Dark Optimist wrote: Fri Aug 09, 2019 9:23 pm I've said this about other posters - I'm wondering if someone is trying to build a better bot and figured they'd use us to help train the system.

It is not moot because it's not relevant.

The fact that the code of Hamurabi is still studied for historical or philosophical purposes does not give it any relevance to current day and place.

A law passed in another country in another century that has long since been superseded by other legislation and case law has no relevance. If I am going to engage in a thought experiment, I have a very long list of items to contemplate before this.
Private international law and the conflict in laws is part of the new modern system of law based on territory and those that reside within that territory are bound to that state/provincial laws. English law and jurisdiction for the subject is based on international law (law of nations) and the law of domicile that was created from prescription of ancient and feudal common law of land tenure based on fee simple as life tenant with only a right of possession under what is know known as Law of Property, the other moderns systems are also based on the same rules of Law of property where all within international law only have a right of possession (use) under a strict settlement based on the feudal land tenure by prescription.

Private international law, and the retrospective operation of statutes; a treatise on the conflict of laws, and the limits of their operation in respect of place and time
by Savigny, Friedrich Karl von, 1779-1861 https://archive.org/details/privateinte ... t/page/n11

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ignorance of the laws of land, yet everyone wants to enforce the fraud established by their own English common law 13. eliz... called equity. the trust. equity is a trust and all citizens volunteer.
since its seems no one can read law books with to many words discussing to complicated of matters, ill let the pictures tell what the fraud is, yet doubt will understand since you all think legal and equitable titles are lawful, they are not, they are legal created by the statute of uses...... and equity is not fraud for those that join it and grant the lands by making an express trust as life tenants under law of property, yet this is still too confusing ..............
A Treatise on the Construction of the Statutes, 13 Eliz. C. 5, and 27 Eliz
https://archive.org/details/atreatiseon ... og/page/n9

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it seems quatloos needs to make a new section for the settlors to the lands, to address the fraudulent conveyances of those in equity when forced onto those that only want absolute freedoms and not to volunteer by an express trust....

the law is exact, everything is written by your top legal scholars and judges, your issues is with them as the jurisprudence to the Settled Land Act states along with the links to those sources.....

i find it funny that everyone states common law, and equity follows it, yet can not see it when shown or discussed then fall back on the acceptance and the rules of the acceptance as laws for all when that is simple not true.

this also creates the issue of fraud in which is recognized by all English law, yet not a website focused on scams, based on fraud, yet do not know how to determine what law one is bound by or what law of property is even in it most simplest forms.
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by parzival »

forgot, many dont understand the rules of repeal so i will post the current form of 13 eliz that is a common law statute with the equitable act of legislation,....
Law of Property Act 1925
Part IX
Voidable Dispositions
173 Voluntary disposition of land how far voidable as against purchasers.
(1)Every voluntary disposition of land made with intent to defraud a subsequent purchaser is voidable at the instance of that purchaser.
(2)For the purposes of this section, no voluntary disposition, whenever made, shall be deemed to have been made with intent to defraud by reason only that a subsequent conveyance for valuable consideration was made, if such subsequent conveyance was made after the twenty-eighth day of June, eighteen hundred and ninety-three.
174 Acquisitions of reversions at an under value.
(1)No acquisition made in good faith, without fraud or unfair dealing, of any reversionary interest in real or personal property, for money or money’s worth, shall be liable to be opened or set aside merely on the ground of under value.In this subsection “reversionary interest” includes an expectancy or possibility.
(2)This section does not affect the jurisdiction of the court to set aside or modify unconscionable bargains.
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Ge ... 20/part/IX
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by parzival »

what does this mean :shrug:
R. v. C. (W. J.), 2008 MBCA 11 (CanLII)
How does repealing a statute affect another statute that incorporates it by reference?
28 Generally speaking, when legislation is repealed, it ceases to be law. As described by Professor Ruth Sullivan, Sullivan and Driedger on the Construction of Statutes, 4th ed. (Markham: Butterworths Canada Ltd., 2002) (at p. 527):
Repeal is the key terminal event in the operation of legislation. When a repeal takes effect, the repealed legislation ceases to be law and ceases to be binding or to produce legal effects. … It also means that everything dependent on the repealed legislation for its existence or efficacy ceases to exist or to produce effects.)

29 This rule can be displaced by statute and, indeed, several survival clauses were built into the federal Interpretation Act. One of these clauses, s. 44(h) of the Interpretation Act, provides some assistance in addressing the issue at hand. It reads as follows:
Where an enactment, in this section called the “former enactment”, is repealed and another enactment, in this section called the “new enactment”, is substituted therefor,
(h) any reference in an unrepealed enactment to the former enactment shall, with respect to a subsequent transaction, matter or thing, be read and construed as a reference to the provisions of the new enactment relating to the same subject-matter as the former enactment, but where there are no provisions in the new enactment relating to the same subject-matter, the former enactment shall be read as unrepealed in so far as is necessary to maintain or give effect to the unrepealed enactment.[emphasis added]
:Axe:

confused capacities to confused agreement.....
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by wserra »

parzival wrote: Fri Aug 09, 2019 9:52 pmit seems quatloos needs to make a new section for the settlors to the lands
We're in the process of doing just that.
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by Arthur Rubin »

Maybe I missed it, but has anyone pointed out that the "Settled Land Act"s only apply to rights (of ownership and use of) land (real property in the US; I don't know what it's called in Canada or the UK).
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by Chaos »

wserra wrote: Fri Aug 09, 2019 11:27 pm
parzival wrote: Fri Aug 09, 2019 9:52 pmit seems quatloos needs to make a new section for the settlors to the lands
We're in the process of doing just that.
well played.
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by HardyW »

parzival wrote: Fri Aug 09, 2019 10:21 pm what does this mean :shrug:
R. v. C. (W. J.), 2008 MBCA 11 (CanLII)
How does repealing a statute affect another statute that incorporates it by reference?
28 Generally speaking, when legislation is repealed, it ceases to be law. As described by Professor Ruth Sullivan, Sullivan and Driedger on the Construction of Statutes, 4th ed. (Markham: Butterworths Canada Ltd., 2002) (at p. 527):
Repeal is the key terminal event in the operation of legislation. When a repeal takes effect, the repealed legislation ceases to be law and ceases to be binding or to produce legal effects. … It also means that everything dependent on the repealed legislation for its existence or efficacy ceases to exist or to produce effects.)

29 This rule can be displaced by statute and, indeed, several survival clauses were built into the federal Interpretation Act. One of these clauses, s. 44(h) of the Interpretation Act, provides some assistance in addressing the issue at hand. It reads as follows:
Where an enactment, in this section called the “former enactment”, is repealed and another enactment, in this section called the “new enactment”, is substituted therefor,
(h) any reference in an unrepealed enactment to the former enactment shall, with respect to a subsequent transaction, matter or thing, be read and construed as a reference to the provisions of the new enactment relating to the same subject-matter as the former enactment, but where there are no provisions in the new enactment relating to the same subject-matter, the former enactment shall be read as unrepealed in so far as is necessary to maintain or give effect to the unrepealed enactment.[emphasis added]


confused capacities to confused agreement.....
You seem to base your whole thesis on this clause which really needs only one phrase to have "emphasis added":
Where an enactment, in this section called the “former enactment”, is repealed and another enactment, in this section called the “new enactment”, is substituted therefor,
(h)any reference in an unrepealed enactment to the former enactment shall, with respect to a subsequent transaction, matter or thing, be read and construed as a reference to the provisions of the new enactment relating to the same subject-matter as the former enactment, but where there are no provisions in the new enactment relating to the same subject-matter, the former enactment shall be read as unrepealed in so far as is necessary to maintain or give effect to the unrepealed enactment.[emphasis added]
So there is no reason for you to claim that all the old law you have quoted isn't actually repealed: it is repealed, it has ceased to be, it is ex-law. Quoting books written about the law, in some cases as it was before 1535 is unnecessary and misguided.
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by HardyW »

parzival wrote: Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:49 pm The issue is confused capacities to confused agreements.

The citizen and the sovereign citizen group are both wrong on the foundations to English law and equity as follows:

Confused capacities:
Citizens:

believe they are true owners as a Engish subject bound to the law of property.
In English law the current term is "Commonwealth citizen" though perhaps Canadian law calls it something else. In any event property law does not depend on nationality.

state there is no such thing as a trust.
No, but most property transactions do not involve a trust in any way.

understand they are bound by government but can not prove whyfollowing the principle of "consent of the governed" which you call "agreements" and most of us call "elections".

are bound to law of domicile, yet do not know why.
In England ownership does not depend on nationality or on domicile. That is why so much property in London for example, is owned by Russian oligarchs and wealthy Arab sheikhs.

Sovereign citizens:

Believe they are not subject to any law but the law they write probably true
Believe there is a trust for those subject as English law subject no idea what this is supposed to mean
Believe they are free and not bound to government rule probably true


Confused agreements
what happens when the individual making issue is not part of Equity as a life tenant? Confused.

Each one of the classes of subjects (capacities in law) within English law only have certain rights and duties based on who is making an issue. Confused.

When the sovereign citizens make claim against any other capacity as life tenant this is life tenant vs life tenant, where the law used by both is LAW OF PROPERTY, and are equal within that law, yet the judges are correct, and the citizens for the most part on the fraudulent claims based on what is claimed and by whom and the one in possession of what is claimed.Confused.
The great majority of issues made by so-called sovereign citizens have nothing to do with real property so the above is meaningless as well as confused.
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

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HardyW wrote: Sat Aug 10, 2019 7:45 am So there is no reason for you to claim that all the old law you have quoted isn't actually repealed: it is repealed, it has ceased to be, it is ex-law. Quoting books written about the law, in some cases as it was before 1535 is unnecessary and misguided.
Exactly. parzival is only demonstrating that he/she cannot see the forest for the trees. It was apparent to me when he/she referenced the Domesday book that this whole exercise had no basis in reality and that parzival believes that somehow laws never expire and that they continue in force. I wonder if parzival believes that rulings by the high courts, such as the US Supreme Court, conduct their deliberations by researching the Domesday Book to see if the issue under review meets its antiquated requirements.
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by parzival »

Since so many are so confused, lets see what canlii and the reforms have to say about this.....

Common Law vs Equity

In order to understand how common law is the foundation to Equity we need to look to the history of English law (why so much is posted yet so many complain to many words), the monarchy creates law for government, these laws are grants, giving rights in exchange for duties to manage the interests of the monarchy.

From 1066 until great revolution of 1600 the English monarchy was considered supreme individual power, The Interregnum was from 1649–1660, The Restoration of the English monarchy took place in 1660 by 1688 there was a new British Monarchy.

The great revolution is the freedoms recognized today (yet not by some), simply the government (BOOK 1, CHAPTER 2 Of The Parliament) kicked out the monarchy and what used to be the kings (no king) councils (BOOK 1, CHAPTER 5 Of the Councils Belonging to the King) decided to create law in around about way (another topic for another day), by appointing a new “constitutional” monarchy to create laws for government to manage the civil law (BOOK 1, CHAPTER 12 Of The Civil State) for the municipal subject (BOOK 1, CHAPTER 1 Of the Absolute Rights of Individuals) within municipal corporation (statute W&M 5&6).

https://lonang.com/library/reference/bl ... -england/
Pre 1688 monarchy was a tyranny based on a monarchy not recognizing the rights of all people as equals within English law (only the lord manors and the Councils Belonging to the King had a trust as part of roman law), post 1688 the monarchy is a “constitutional” monarchy granted from those bound the the statute of use 1535 and fraudulent conveyances 1571 and since 1925 all are now equal within Equity, but not the common law.

The new constitutional monarchy is based on the title of the new monarchy (BOOK 1, CHAPTER 3 Of The King, and His Title) which also has duties as a trustee (BOOK 1, CHAPTER 6 Of the King’s Duties) based on a constitutional monarchy title (BOOK 1, CHAPTER 7, Of the King’s Prerogative) to make sure the new trustee has the power to manage the trust fully (BOOK 1, CHAPTER 8 Of the King’s Revenue) with the assumed rights as owner, as it is in all trust law within English law.

The most confusing part of English law is the 3 levels of trust (magna charta & statute west 1st (to lord manors), statute of uses 1535 (to Govt), Law of Property 1925 (to life tenant)) that was created by monarchy granted by law to govt and then the settlor constitutes the trust from taking from govt and becoming a life tenant).
The creation of the modern system of equity is the overthrow of the tyrannical monarchy and appointed a trustee to guarantee the absolute freedoms of a free agent and that choice.

The 3 levels of trust are as follows:

Settlor grants by express trust to the monarchy a land settlement
Monarchy grants to crown corporation by law (not trust) the right to manage the use of lands and incorporeal hereditaments (statute of uses 1535, BNA Act, Settled Land Act, LOP, Trustee Act, Settled Estates Act, Statute westminster 1932).
Government with only a grant of Statue of uses 1535 removes the Common law monarchy, and appoints a constitutional monarchy in 1688.(all created after 1688 BNA Act, Settled Land Act, LOP, Trustee Act, Settled Estates Act, Statute westminster 1932)
Monarchy grants equitable use to lands BNA Act 1867. (government takes assumed ownership of lands in breach of BNA Act), the governments have no constitution and no powers granted to have such power.

Mercer v. Attorney General for Ontario, 1881 CanLII 6 (SCC)
http://www.canlii.org/en/ca/scc/doc/188 ... pletePos=1
The sovereign chosen by society holds the land in trust for the people, as a fidei commissum.
fidei commissum is also known as cestuique trust as the “beneficiary”.
Blacks law 9th edition : fideicommissum: from brevity, the fideicommissum will here be called “the trust”, the person upon whom it was imposed (fiduciarius) 'the trustee', and the person in whose favor it was imposed (fideicommissarius) the “beneficiary”.
Fideicommissarius: See Cestuequi Trust.
Cestuequi Trust: One who possesses equitable rights in property.
Cestque vie: The person whose life measures the duration of trust,gift,estate, or insurance contract.
1881 SCC 6, 5 SCR 538 -Mercer v. Attorney General for Ontario
(701-2)…It was admitted by the learned counsel who represented the provinces in the argument before us, that this was true with respect to all matters of legislation, but it was contented that when the Act (Const. 1867) deals with “property” the rule was inverted and that the provinces take “all property” not by the Act in precise terms given to the Dominion.
The sole foundation for this contention appears to me to be based upon an assumption which in my judgment is altogether ERRONEOUS, namely, that the BNA Act, transfers as it were the legal estate in the Crown property from the Crown and vests it in the Dominion and the provinces respectively as corporations capable of holding property, real and personal, to them, their successors and assigns forever, BUT THE ACT CONTEMPLATES NO SUCH THING;
The new constitutional monarchy in conjunction with the UK government (as required by the new law, “appointed by govt with only a use for a fee and no power at all”) created, bill of rghts, act of settlements, Settled Land Act, Law of property, trustee act and settled estates act and in 1925 consolidated all these acts.
Statute westminster 1932 grants the rest of the powers required for governments to create a constitution, based on the rules of the monarchy statutes (common law).
1982 governments create constitution, constituting the trust from the monarchy.
Now governments can create law only for their subject and only under a trust of land as the common law act state and can never circumvent this fact.

If one takes time to look at what was granted by these different grants (why the test to trust law was posted), the lands have been the only thing granted, yet the people by choosing the newly created jurisdiction has ratified joining the new jurisdiction, based on the kings title, prerogative etc.

This may still seem hard to understand, yet if we look to the jurisprudence to the settled land act and settled estates act we start to get a real understanding of what English common law is vs what equity is in its most natural form and that is making common law tyranny into a trust.

The forgotten statute commentary from canlii will shed light on what is common law, how common law is implied, and many other interesting aspects i dont think many can see that is contained in the Enlgish law and equity.

Unsettled Estates: Manitoba's Forgotten Statute and the Chupryk Case
https://commentary.canlii.org/w/canlii/ ... cs240.pdf The short note which follows, then, is designed to show how the Manitoba Court of Appeal, in the case of Chupryk v Haykowski, misrepresented the Manitoba law of settled estates by ignoring or suppressing the existence of the English Settled Estates Act of 1856 as part of this province’s law; and how, in so doing, they obliquely sought to justify a unique, and I believe a misguided interpretation of another provincial statute – the partition-and-sale provisions of the Law of Property Act – to achieve the Court’s preferred outcome in the Chupryk case.
What in fact the Court of Appeal did was to turn the absence of the 1882 legislation in Manitoba into a more sweeping assertion – that “Manitoba has no Settled Lands10 Act” – and present that assertion in such a way as to imply that Manitoba was in some way uniquely disadvantaged by this lacuna in its statute-book. It is my position in this paper that any such assertions are demonstrably wrong.
IV.
When O’Sullivan JA states, in the above-quoted passage, that “Manitoba has no Settled Lands Act,” his words are literally true. Manitoba has never had a statute of that name. Nor has any other Canadian province, so far as I am aware. The English statutes bearing that title – both the Settled Land Act of 1882, and the climactic Settled Land Act of 192511 – have been the object of sometimes wistful academic commentary in Canada, but have never been fully adopted in any Canadian jurisdiction. As Professor Waters put it, “The Settled Land Acts of 1882 and 1925 in England never came to Canada.”12 So Manitoba is hardly unique in not having a statute by that name. However, O’Sullivan JA’s assertion, in the same sentence, that Ontario and British Columbia “have enacted Settled Lands Acts” throws some light on what he is really trying to say. So do his perceptions, expressed in that same paragraph, as to what a proper “Settled Land Act” does, what its functions are. It seems that when O’Sullivan JA refers to “Settled Land” legislation, he is using the expression in a loose or generic sense, rather than as a more meticulously historic (or more pedantic) commentator might do. He is, it seems, using the “Settled Land Act” label to embrace a whole procession of
enactments, including not only the statutes which from 1882 onwards bore that name in England, but the procession of more modest enactments which proceeded and heralded them, and bore the name “Settled Estates Acts.”
A different, but less disturbing criticism that might be leveled at his analysis is simply that in its “lumping together” of Settled Estates Acts and Settled Land Acts, it conceals more than it reveals. For purists, as they might term themselves, would certainly insist that despite their superficial similarities of name and function, there is a gulf between them in terms of the social and political theory which underlies them. This is not the place to examine the political struggle which attended the introduction of the first Settled Land Act in 1882, but it was regarded at the time as little short of revolutionary.
I propose in my third and last article in this series, in a forthcoming volume of the journal, to revive and re-examine the social exigencies which gave rise to the debate, and its influence on the law’s entire conception of what “ownership” of land means, and should mean, in the context of limited estate-holding. It seems to me that the arguments then in play may be of interest again in light of the new era of real property law
The Act of 1882 differs from all previous legislation in regard to settled land. It proceeds on different lines, and it has a different object in view. The Settled Estates Acts did not confer or enable the Court to confer on a limited owner powers beyond those ordinarily inserted in a well-drawn settlement. They were no doubt very useful Acts in their way. An application to the Court at a moderate cost was made to serve the purposes of a private estate Act. But the Settled Land Act was founded upon a broader policy and has a larger scope. A period of agricultural depression, which shewed no sign of abatement, had given rise to a popular outcry against settlements. The problem was how to relieve settled land from the mischief which strict settlements undoubtedly did in some cases produce, without doing away altogether with the power of bringing land into settlement. That was something very different from the task to which Parliament addressed itself in framing the Settled Estates Acts. In those Acts the Legislature did not look beyond the interests of the persons entitled under the settlement. In the Settled Land Act the paramount object of the Legislature was the well-being of settled land. The interests of the persons entitled under the settlement are protected by the Act as far as it was possible to protect them. They must be duly considered by the trustees or by the Court whenever the trustees or the Court may be called upon to act. But it is evident I think that the Legislature did not intend that the main purpose of the Act should be frustrated by too nice a regard for those interests. 16

or Manitoba has had, since the date of its enactment; still had in 1980 when Chupryk was decided, and I believe has still (for what it is worth), the Settled Estates Act, 1856.17 We shall consider it presently.
without alluding to the fact that the two statutes in question bore the respective titles of “the Settled Estates Act19 and “the Land (Settled Estate) Act”.20 In the same breath, O’Sullivan JA then muses “But Manitoba has no Settled Lands Act.” Not only is this wrong, if we accord to that label the inclusive meaning which the learned judge himself accords to it; but it created a false impression by inference,21 that unlike other, happier and more progressive jurisdictions, that there is (or was) in Manitoba a total void, just where a Manitoba Settled Lands Act ought to be.
An effort will now be made to give a more accurate picture of the statute law governing settled estates in Manitoba, as it stood at the time of the Chupryk case. Let me begin by introducing that most neglected of statutes, the Settled Estates Act of 1856.
The 1856 act is of great importance to this paper in a way in which its more elaborate and ambitious successors are not. It requires our attention precisely because it was at all times since its enactment, at all times material to our present inquiry – notably when Chupryk was before the courts – and in my view still is, part of the law of Manitoba, as well as that of some other provinces.33 Let me now justify these assertions.
I would contend first that the 1856 Act is part of Manitoba law by reason of the fundamental rules governing the reception of English statutes in the settled colonies. Those rules as laid out by Blackstone, were explained and applied by the Manitoba Court of Appeal itself in Meanwell v Meanwell in 1941,34 but the fullest and clearest analysis of the doctrine of reception, both as to statute and judge-made law is surely that of Mr. Jean Côté, as he then was, in his justly-famous articles in the Alberta Law Review, in 1964 and 1977 respectively
Noting that the 1856 Act has nonetheless never been welcomed into the limelight in Manitoba by any judicial utterance, favourable or otherwise, should we be dismayed or surprised that it has survived so long in the shade? Professor Bruce Ziff, in his valuable textbook,45 seems to find it an embarrassing survival,
As for the content of the 1856 Act, Professor Ziff’s criticisms could be appropriately directed not at those who conceived and drafted the statute, but at the generations of legislatures who totally failed in the ensuing century or more to update and expand the range of transactions which it enabled. The embattled life tenant of 1856, denied powers of sale or leasing by his unimaginative or spiteful settlor, would not have regarded the conferral of such powers by statute, and the removal of the need to seek a private Act of Parliament,47 as “emaciated” or “worthless” reforms. If they have become so – and they have – it is because the 1856 Act has been long since overtaken by events, which have made it redundant. For better or worse, I would merely assert again that it is still there, as part of the law of Manitoba,48 of Saskatchewan and of Alberta too

But redundant it undoubtedly is. Until 1983 when, as explained below, all life tenants were made willy-nilly the beneficiaries (and usually also the trustees) of a legislatively imposed trust,49 the 1856 Act might be of use when a life tenant under a common law settlement felt the need to make a sale or lease of the fee simple. That would not be often, since express settlements are not commonly created these days, and when they do occur, are usually effected under a trust; which brings into play the extensive facilities for Court-approved dispositions of all kinds, afforded in Manitoba by the Trustee Act, s 58(1).50

Prescriptions extinctive vs acquisitive
Re Alfrey Investments Ltd. and Shefsky Developments Ltd. et al., 1974 CanLII 709 (ON SC)
Extinguishment of Owner's Title. A person in possession of land in the assumed character of owner, and exercising possibly the ordinary rights of ownership, has a perfectly good title against all the world but the rightful owner. And if the rightful owner does not come forward and assert his title by process of law within the period prescribed by the provisions of The Statute of Limitations applicable to the case, his right is forever extinguished, and the possessory owner acquires an absolute title. The Statute of Limitations is a law of extinctive, not of acquisitive prescription. It operates to bar the owner out of possession, not to confer title on the trespasser or disseisor in possession.

is a law of extinctive, not of acquisitive prescription is the same as . It operates to bar the owner out of possession, not to confer title on the trespasser or disseisor in possession.
prescription is the grant to the monarchy,
possession is the law of property, based on the common law land tenure, based from the prescriptions
extinctive is in fee (statute of uses), acquisitive is absolute (free agent).
***Links to source in first post***

Land (Settled Estates) Act
By following the reforms and repeals also explains the history and authority, yet only up till the last reform, then must keep looking to these reforms all the way to the common law grant the governments can not change, yet can make equity whatever they want……...
LAW REFORM COMMISSION OF BRITISH COLUMBIA
REPORT ON THELAND (SETTLED ESTATE) ACT

http://www.bcli.org/sites/default/files ... te_Act.pdf

Trustee act
A Modern Trustee Act for British Columbia
A Report prepared for the British Columbia Law Institute by its Committee on the Modernization of the Trustee Act
http://www.bcli.org/sites/default/files ... eeAct.pdf
A. Trusts Generally
Few legal concepts pervade as wide a range of common dealings as that of the trust.
Trust principles are commonly in play when an employee pays into a pension fund, when a
person makes a will that is anything other than of the simplest kind, and in a sale of land
pending actual transfer into the purchaser’s name. These are only a very few examples.
At the root of the trust concept is the idea that segregated property is held by one or
more persons (trustees) for the benefit of one or more others (beneficiaries). A trust is the
relationship between a trustee and the beneficiary, characterized by an obligation on the part
of the trustee, which the beneficiary may enforce, to deal with property in the trustee’s
control for the benefit of the beneficiary.1 A trust is established when an owner of property
(called the settlor2) makes a disposition of property to a trustee on terms describing how the
trustee is to administer the property to confer the benefits that the settlor intends. As an
alternative to parting with the legal title, the settlor may declare that henceforth he or she
holds the property in trust for the beneficiary. In either case, an alienation of property occurs
because the beneficial ownership of the property is considered to be transferred to the
beneficiary.


B. Trustee Legislation
1. General
The law of trusts is primarily found in cases, but it is partly statutory. Statute law
relating to trusts is mainly concerned with the administration of trusts rather than with the
relationships between settlors, trustees, and beneficiaries. In British Columbia, the principal
statute concerned with trust law is the Trustee Act.3 Like its counterparts in other provinces
and territories, it is largely a re-enactment of English trustee legislation passed at various
times in the nineteenth century.4

2. Historic Purposes of Trustee Legislation
One purpose of the nineteenth-century English legislation was to provide machinery to
allow proper administration of trusts with a minimum of court involvement in cases where
trustees had not been given adequate administrative powers at the time the trust was created.5
It therefore took the form of enabling legislation, conferring basic administrative powers on
all trustees, executors, and administrators.
An important feature of trustee legislation was that its enabling provisions conferring
powers on trustees did not override the express terms of a trust, will, or codicil. A settlor
could exclude statutory powers by using express language. In other words, trustees were
deemed by law to have the statutory powers unless the express terms of the trust stated
otherwise.

Another purpose of trustee legislation was to give the court effective powers to deal with
situations in which a trust had ceased to operate effectively and to define the court’s power
to assist trustees when necessary.6 Among the specific powers given to the court by the
legislation were the power to appoint and remove trustees, to vest trust property in others
when a trusteewas incapacitated or otherwise unable to act, and to authorize the distribution
of trust property among known beneficiaries, with or without ordering the trustee to pay a
portion of the trust fund into court for the benefit of untraceable beneficiaries. The court was
also empowered to give its opinion in non-litigious circumstances on a specific question
6. Trusts arising by operation of law
Trusts arising by operation of law, or that are declared by a court to exist (constructive
trusts), are chiefly remedial in nature. They generally do not require the full administrative
machinery of an express trust in order to fulfil their function. For example, it would not be
desirable to equip a resulting or constructive trustee with powers to delegate authority to an
agent or invest the trust property when the function of the trust is to confirm that the property
is not the trustee’s own and to expedite its transfer to the rightful owner. Therefore, the
Committee believes a new Trustee Act should not apply generally to resulting trusts, nor to
constructive or similar trusts arising by operation of law or through a judgment or order of
a court.31

G. Conclusion
The Trustee Act has been allowed to stagnate. Revision of this nineteenth-century
legislation is overdue by many decades. The original purposes of the Act, namely to
supplement the general law of trusts, confer necessary administrative powers on trustees
where they are lacking, and guide the court in the exercise of its supportive and supervisory
jurisdiction over trusts and trustees, nevertheless retain their validity and importance.

As you will see, equity is the trust, all those subject as citizens are life tenants that have agreed and are bound to the Law of Property and the Settled Land Act and will be held to that agreement first, since equity takes priority.

Now back to the questions, I wonder at what point an answer will be possible?
What happens if you as life tenant get a notice from one claiming to be settlor to the Settled Land Act 1925 as required by that act,
(For the sake of holding a type of moot situation all the information in the notice is correct as required by the settled land act,)

Do you (as citizens) comply with the notice to transfer the required legal estate as required by s.16(1)(ii), or would you refuse and neglect those duties based on your belief without looking to the Settled Land Act 1925 ?
if you as citizen with legal title try to sell (anything) to a settlor for valuable consideration, is this type of conveyance a legal conveyance or considered fraudulent conveyance within the fraudulent conveyance of English law and equity?

in other words can the citizen sell to a settlor (or anyone not within English law) as a valuable consideration that transfers the right of absolute ownership and possession (droit droit)?
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by parzival »

dont ignore these

Private international law, and the retrospective operation of statutes; a treatise on the conflict of laws, and the limits of their operation in respect of place and time
by Savigny, Friedrich Karl von, 1779-1861 https://archive.org/details/privateinte ... t/page/n11

Jones on Prescription: A Practical Treatise on the Real Property Limitation Act of Revised https://archive.org/details/jonesonpres ... g/page/n28

dont ignore prescriptions, ..........and like to point out they are only in fee ........

Acquisitive Prescription. Its Existing World-Wide Uniformity https://archive.org/details/jstor-783887/page/n1

Prescription Other Than in Fee https://archive.org/details/jstor-1323435/page/n1
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by NYGman »

Again putting cart before horse and vomiting pages of poorly written and somewhat confusong information was not the ask. It was for you to phrase the position in a way ee can understand so we can ask questions, but since you are asking some...
parzival wrote: Mon Aug 12, 2019 1:07 am Now back to the questions, I wonder at what point an answer will be possible?
What happens if you as life tenant get a notice from one claiming to be settlor to the Settled Land Act 1925 as required by that act,
(For the sake of holding a type of moot situation all the information in the notice is correct as required by the settled land act,)

I don't get the question as an individual, am not a life tenant, I am a person under the law. Also, as a US legal resident, living in the US this act is of no relevance to me what so ever

Do you (as citizens) comply with the notice to transfer the required legal estate as required by s.16(1)(ii), or would you refuse and neglect those duties based on your belief without looking to the Settled Land Act 1925 ?
ignoring the irrelevance, I would comply with either the terms of the trust, or a decision or ruling from a court, in the event of a dispute. As a citizen of the US this act doesn't apply to me here, and further, it doesn't look to apply much after 1996 anyway. A quick google of this act Made it seem very specific anyway and I doubt much is actually impacted by this act anymore anyway. So how a virtually irrelevant act impacts me or most people for that matter, us unclear. Not only that it only apply in certain narrow situations. Additional you seem to be giving this outdated act more scope than it actually has.



if you as citizen with legal title try to sell (anything) to a settlor for valuable consideration, is this type of conveyance a legal conveyance or considered fraudulent conveyance within the fraudulent conveyance of English law and equity?

trying to dumb it down for you here, as the question seems to lack a basic understanding of a sale. Assuming it isn't some prohibited property, or something illegal, I should be able to come to a mutually agreement with another party, to exchange my property for some form of consideration I find fair. This is typically the art of the deal, and would be appropriate under contract law, as a bargained exchange..

in other words can the citizen sell to a settlor (or anyone not within English law) as a valuable consideration that transfers the right of absolute ownership and possession (droit droit)?
I couldn't care less who I sell to, as long as I get something of value which I find satisfactory, it is of no relevance to me.
I guess I don't get it as I am not a trust, my property is not held in trust, I don't often deal with trust counter parties outside work, and a 1925 non US law has no application or relevance to me, I still don't get what you are trying to prove.

I will try again, please without the history lesson , without the links and word salad copy pasting you seem to love, for what probably won't be the last time, what is your position in 2 sentences?

I will try to help. Is it that: the 1925 act you love so much, converts all property holdings into trusts, and there are certain restrictions on those trust holdings.
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by AnOwlCalledSage »

Ah, I see what the problem is. It's a simple of misunderstanding between whether we are "confused" or "don't give a stuff".
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by Burnaby49 »

Put me solid in the "Don't give a flying fuck" classification. Why bother to try and parse some vestige of sense out of total gibberish?
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by NYGman »

I just don't get what is so hard for Parzival to state his freekin' position.
A short convince statement of his belief, prehaps beginning with:
I believe that ...

However each post that he seems to start to do that ends up in pages of incomprehensible statements strung together, with the expectation that the reader can follow some convoluted logic without a hint of what the endgame is.

I have tried to read the words, and I am sure in some other order they may actually mean something to me, but while the words are in fact real words, that is all that seems correct in his posts. Sort of reminds me of the old Morecambe and Wise sketch with André Previn.
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by Burnaby49 »

I just don't get what is so hard for Parzival to state his freekin' position.
He can't explain his position because he has no position. Stop thinking inability to explain and start considering deliberate obscurity. We've had numerous posters in the past doing exactly the same thing. Spewing out vast quantities of gibberish that don't lead to any remotely understandable argument. Ask a question as to the core position being promoted and you get another blizzard of total incomprehensibility. The issue isn't Parzival's apparent inability to distill masses of garbage to a specific belief or point. Parzival has no point, he's just trolling. That was obvious from his first posting.
"Yes Burnaby49, I do in fact believe all process servers are peace officers. I've good reason to believe so." Robert Menard in his May 28, 2015 video "Process Servers".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XeI-J2PhdGs
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by NYGman »

Burnaby49 wrote: Mon Aug 12, 2019 9:03 amThe issue isn't Parzival's apparent inability to distill masses of garbage to a specific belief or point. Parzival has no point, he's just trolling. That was obvious from his first posting.
I was prepared to give him the opportunity to try to make a coherent point, he seems desperate to make some sort of point, and I just felt that while he may be trolling he did have some legal theory he was trying explain but decided to just dump a ton of word salad, without explanation instead. I did sort of want to figure out what he was on about, as I find fringe legal theories fascinating, but I can't for the life of me, figure out what his is. Again there are words in his posts, lots of words, very good words, tremendous words even, but arranged in an order that makes them incomprehensible to me.
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by notorial dissent »

There really isn't ANY point refuting/arguing/discussing, since "our learned friend" builds his cloud castles since his basic and fundamental premise(s) is completely utterly and absolutely NOT EVEN WRONG, well actually it is as to all particulars. Gibberish being what it is and all. Thus, all those pages and pages and pages and pages of realistic appearing word salad of wholesale unfeelingly and cruelly slayed electrons, are totally absolutely and utterly of zero information value. As the foundation premise(s) are totally without value or base, so too then, it must follow is all else that issues forth from the fount false premise and gibberish.
The fact that you sincerely and wholeheartedly believe that the “Law of Gravity” is unconstitutional and a violation of your sovereign rights, does not absolve you of adherence to it.
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by noblepa »

NYGman wrote: Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:38 pm Is it at all possible to post a one or two sentence, or at least no longer than a paragraph, and absolutely not pages, with quoted texts and headers. Please try to write it simply without the use of legal terms, as I am not sure you are using terms correctly. To be honest, we Don't care about you logic, or the history right now as it is really hard to figure out what you are on about. Trying to slug through your posts is hurting my head, as I really can't follow it, as it doesn't seem to make much sense to read for me. I honestly had to give up trying to figure out what you are on about as I don't know you premise or point.

So if you want to have a discussion, please sumerize your pont. I think it may be something along the lines of people are property, or there rights are based on those of property, but as that can't be right, or even for the moment, assuming it correct (on a park) please i how that would change things. If you want to point our something, please simplify what you are saying. You should be able to boil it down to a sentence or two. What is your position. Try starting with:


I believe that man is not subject to... Because...

If that is what you are trying to say even, it's so hard to figure out.
I'd be happy if Parzival would simply use complete English sentences, with proper syntax, and a noun and a verb somewhere.

I admit I have been able to read more than a smattering of what he has written, but, what I have read is not really even English. It is composed of English words, but it does not follow the English language rules of syntax and sentence structure. This makes it even more difficult to ascertain exactly what he is babbling about.
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Re: confused capacities & agreements

Post by AndyK »

I can't believe the other Quatloosians are so dense. He's clearly working hard to demonstrate his own confused capacities. Capacity to post in reasonable, grammatically correct English. Capacity to ask, and answer, a simple question. Capacity to comprehend the basic rules of law.
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