Practical Lawful Dissent FMOTL antics, continued...

[SpearGrass]

How nice to see the standard HMCTS response in action so soon. Only issued on Wednesday. Looks like a small thing but the amount of staff time that will save should be huge. There's even a possibility that some people will read the second paragraph and seek out advice which will help them rather than dig them deeper in the mire.

[longdog]

A little something I knocked up...

[aesmith]

Ms Quinn's put up a crowd funding thing ... https://www.gofundme.com/f/quinn-blakey ... gal-battle
I'm sure one of the comments somewhere said this was supposed to be for her "legal costs" rather than to pay the fixed penalties, but that's not actually stated on her page.

[Hercule Parrot]

A little something I knocked up...

Brilliant!

[hucknallred]

Was unsure whether to put this in random babblings or here. I think here wins as she's using lots of stuff from the PLD groups.
It looks like she's 'served' The Rozzers with the notices & they've decided that breaches lock down.

[John Uskglass]

Latest from Sinead Quinn

https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/loc ... g-19375125

A salon owner has responded to a court's closure order with laughter - and a defiant 'rant' on camera.

Sinead Quinn posted a video today on the salon's Instagram page after magistrates in Bradford granted a closure order submitted by Kirklees Council for opening during lockdown.

The order, granted today, means Quinn Blakey Hairdressers must not open until after midnight tomorrow when the current national lockdown ends.

Unfortunately, as lockdown 2.0 ends tomorrow, the closure order was only for a couple of days. Which will encourage her to think she's had a win, no doubt.

[Hercule Parrot]

Unfortunately, as lockdown 2.0 ends tomorrow, the closure order was only for a couple of days. Which will encourage her to think she's had a win, no doubt.

We must hope that the authorities dispel such thoughts by pursuing the £27,000 she currently owes. This pandemic isn't over yet, and allowing scofflaws the last laugh sends quite the wrong message. She must be broken on the wheel pour encourage les outres, I fear.

[aesmith]

They actually cancelled one of the £10,000 tickets. She's still due to pay £17,000 though. However I do wonder, if she manages to get that reduced maybe she could end up ahead compared to loss of business if she'd complied. On the other hand she also noted that she lost quite a few customers because she wouldn't wear a mask.

When they say "fines" I am pretty sure these are actually Fixed Penalty Notices. However I'm not sure whether if these are unpaid they get treated as unpaid fines, or whether the authority would have to prosecute.

[hucknallred]

When they say "fines" I am pretty sure these are actually Fixed Penalty Notices. However I'm not sure whether if these are unpaid they get treated as unpaid fines, or whether the authority would have to prosecute.

Interesting she lost punters by not wearing a mask herself. The place that cuts my remaining locks has introduced bookings with prepay online, wears a face shield, checks your temp on entry, washes all hair pre cut & has masks for those who turn up without.
He told me he still gets people who book & turn up without. He offers them a mask if they decline he shuts the door & refunds their money.
On the subject of the fixed penalty notices, you have an option of a court hearing, much like a speeding ticket.
I can see lots of these getting challenged in the courts in coming months. I suspect she will go in court with magna carta guns blazing.

[aesmith]

On the subject of the fixed penalty notices, you have an option of a court hearing, much like a speeding ticket.

A speeding ticket is actually a "conditional offer of fixed penalty", and if the recipient simply does nothing then the onus is on the Police to initiate proceedings. I believe that other types of traffic tickets, actual fixed penalties, the onus is round the other way and the recipient has to actively opt for court. If they do nothing it gets registered as an unpaid fine.

Reading again I'm not 100% clear what she means, was it just "in the beginning" when she wouldn't wear a mask?

Ben Clark
Sinéad Quinn have you had much support from your custom base? I haven’t stopped working but it’s damaged my custom a fair bit

Sinéad Quinn
Ben Clark I lost a lot in the beginning when I didn’t comply and wear a mask

Lisa Megrath
Sinéad Quinn I lost loads of clients too from not wearing a mask and not complying x

[AnOwlCalledSage]

A speeding ticket is actually a "conditional offer of fixed penalty", and if the recipient simply does nothing then the onus is on the Police to initiate proceedings.

Now this may be true "on the roadside", but the process for a fixed penalty means that they do initiate proceedings. This process perhaps should not be confused with a fixed penalty parking/bus lane fine which has been decriminalised and is dealt with outside the criminal law.

For speeding the police will send you a notice of intended prosecution by post, for which you have the "conditional offer" of paying the fixed penalty, taking it to court or, if you are lucky, the option of a course.

All I will say is that I currently have no points on my licence

My understanding is that the Covid restrictions are criminal penalties.

[aesmith]

Now this may be true "on the roadside",

Yes, sorry I was making the assumption that speeding ticket meant one dealt with by post. I actually don't think they hand out roadside FPNs for speeding nowadays, the course/fixed penalty/court decision being made at the office. Apart from anything else they couldn't issue an FPN for someone who already had 9 points.

However I think the distinction is still correct. A road traffic FPN if ignored is escalated as an unpaid court fine. The recipient needs to positively reject and go to court if they want to argue the matter. A COFPN needs to be accepted by the recipient and if ignored then it can only be pursued through court. One significance is in the conditions (the "C") the fixed penalty offer isn't accepted unless you also accept the conditions, like not being about to tot, and remembering to send your licence.

I can't see a clear answer on whether the Coronavirus penalties are one or the other. And this makes a difference for Ms Quinn who I presume has either ignored the FPNs or responded with gibberish. If they're are like traffic FPNs then the next step maybe enforcement of the unpaid penalties. If they're more like an offer the she can argue the matter from scratch in court if/when she gets a summons.

[AnOwlCalledSage]

You are right. Trying to find out the process is next to impossible! The issuance of a Covid FPN not criminal, but some aspects (such as not co-operating with the police) could be criminal.

However, I did find this from the National Police Chiefs Council:

If an FPN is contested or not complied with within the 28 day payment period, the case becomes a matter for HM Courts and Tribunals Service following a force level review.

So I guess, the police get notified of failure to pay and then if they determine that it should proceed to prosecution then that is turned over to HMCTS.

[SpearGrass]

OK, let's explain.
A covid fixed penalty is an alternative to prosecution. In the 28 day payment period there is a bar on prosecution. Payment of the FPN is a permanent bar. It's not a conviction, though it is recorded in police records. On failure to pay it's not enforceable as a fine in the same way as a road traffic fixed penalty or a penalty notice for disorder. Instead the police are free to prosecute for the offence (which they've been doing in the thousands).

The offence is then dealt with by the court in the same way as any other offence, the sentence based on seriousness and harm, and the fine pegged to the offender's known or estimated income. Guidance to magistrates recommends equating the offence with environmental offences, as offenders are creating a risk to public health. That means these are high fines, relatively speaking. The statutory requirement to make the fine relative to income means some people will get a fine less than the fixed penalty, and some more. Plus prosecution costs and the surcharge, which will add another £120 - £300. They'll all get a criminal conviction, which will matter to some people (students for example) more than others.

Then there are the consequences of fine default, which is obviously an issue for pseudo-legals: deduction from benefit, attachment of earnings, seizure of goods and ultimately it could go full Ollie Pinnock.

[John Uskglass]

Kirklees have changed the locks on Ms Quinn's premises, and will be charging her for the costs.

https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/loc ... r-19391007

Includes video shot by Ms Quinn of her confronting the council officer supervising the work.

She complains that she hasn't been notified, and is told that a letter was posted at her home address - 'Well I've not checked my post.'

Not much sympathy for her in the comments.

[John Uskglass]

Salon owner hasn't paid a penny of her £17,000 fines

https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/loc ... y-19421878

Ms Quinn, who claimed Magna Carta gave her the right to ignore the lockdown legislation, was given 28 days to pay from the date the fixed penalty notice fine was issued.

The first fine, for £1,000, was issued on Tuesday, November 10.

Today a council spokesman confirmed that legal action will be taken due to non-payment.

The precise nature of the legal action has not been revealed.

Asked if the council is taking action to recover unpaid fines, a spokesman for Kirklees said: "Yes, legal action will be taken in the courts."

Ms Quinn was declined to comment.

On November 29 she set up a Go Fund Me online page which has raised over £7,000 to date.

Writing on the page, she said: "By no means do I think the council will be successful in trying to extort money from me.

"I am simply doing this so that people don’t take it upon themselves to create a gofundme on my behalf and possibly run off with the money!

"I’m confident in the fact we will win this fight, so in that case the money will go to my amazing brother who is fighting himself against Stage 4bowel cancer, he was diagnosed in August 2020 and he’s 36 years old with a wife and 2 children.

[aesmith]

It's spread over a couple of posts but in among all the nonsense about push for redress and which clerk to send your notices to, I saw this one brewing. Let's hope she gets pulled rather than only caught after she has an accident ...

Krystal's Cutz Practical Lawful Dissent U.K. Canada And Commonwealth
OK so car insurance is killing me I wanna stop paying now what documents please ino they will try fight but I think I'm ready now feel Confident

Krystal's Cutz
Coll Yd you're a star thank you, well policies being cancelled as of now

Krystal's Cutz
Thanks for your help guys I'll let yous no how it goes if I get pulled lol

[John Uskglass]

Krystal's Cutz

Another hairdresser?

[notorial dissent]

Regrettably, it sounds like the latter is more likely than the former, just have this feeling.

[aesmith]

Another hairdresser?

I believe she said mobile hairdresser somewhere. Doesn't sound a great business plan to get your car seized and crushed.