Liberty Dollar Update

[Demosthenes]

Alert #21: August 5th. 2008

Dear Liberty Dollar Supporters,

Please don't miss these articles: Name clarification, Closing, $10 Solution, Ron Paul Nickel, Bernard Prophesy, Ron Paul video, e-Gold news, Two articles and More!

There seems to be some confusion regarding the company name, which is understandable since the name and business entity has changed several times. The company is now incorporated in Nevada as "Liberty Dollar Inc." Please send as many checks as possible and make them all payable to "Liberty Dollar." Thanks.

But you may not have much of an opportunity… as I regret to inform you that the Liberty Dollar may close. This is not hype or threat. It's simply hard reality. It's sad.

Yes, I know it's the Summer Slows and Summer Lows for the metals market. Yes, I know the silver will be HOT in three ! months. Yes, I know you still "support" the Liberty Dollar. But just ask yourself, "What have you ordered from the Liberty Dollar in the last month?"

Unfortunately, I know the answer… for the vast majority… it is "none." I know that because we have received very very few orders in the last 30 days. No donations. And only three $100 contributions to the Contingency Club.

Sorry, but that just isn't enough to stay in business. Yes, the initial response after the raid, eight months ago, was tremendous and you put the Liberty Dollar back in business. Thank you! But the last three months have been terrible. Even with free rent and reduced rates from our attorney, zero income doesn't cover the phone bill, etc. The government wins because they play the attrition game. We lose without your support.

The Good News… is that all is not lost! Maybe the problem has been that you can't order online. Well, you can finally ! order on line and use your card on the new Shopping Cart!! I am very pleased to inform you that the Liberty Dollar Tenth Anniversary specials, the $50, $20, $10 and $5 Silver Libertys, $500 Gold Liberty and all the miscellaneous items are now available from a new merchant who accepts all the major credit/debit cards! You can now place orders online for the first time since the raid!!!

Please visit the new Shopping Cart HERE and order something… anything! We really need your support or Liberty Dollar will close. Send a donation… everything is acceptable. If we can't bank it… we will auction it on eBay. Please show your support for the Liberty Dollar.

More good news: The $10 Solution: Meanwhile, we are preparing our response to the government's Complaint filed in Asheville. I was very pleased that over 4,000 "interested parties" have contacted the US Attorney in Asheville and requested to be informed about their property. That is wonderful. Now, if all 4,000 people simply sent $10… that would be $40,000… enough to fund the initial legal action to get your gold and silver returned. For only $10! Please Click HERE to donate $10 or more for the deadbeats in the group and be a part of the solution. And note that a minimum of $100 is required to be part of the Contingency Club that will pay DOUBLE when we win! Trust me, we are going to win. Regardless of the time or cost… the Liberty Dollar is going to WIN!!! Click HERE to contribute to! the Contingency Club. (Link to CC on the shopping cart)

New Ron Paul Nickel - Sticks it to'em!

Just when those little G-boys thought the Ron Paul movement was dead… Nick Price has created a new Ron Paul Nickel. Can't afford the eBay prices of $200 for a $20 Silver Ron Paul Dollar or even $20 for the $1 Copper Ron Paul… no problem. Nick has a very inexpensive sticker with the Ron Paul Liberty design that just fits on a nickel! Stick it on and stick it to those F!@#$#@S! who confiscated your Liberty Dollars! Let the nickel rage. Plus the "nickel" sticker is extremely well done… even the micro denticle lettering around the border is readable. Prices very on quantity including postage: Minimum of 10 for $4, 100 for $10, 500 for $45 and 1000 stickers for $80. Get stickers on our new Shopping Cart. And stick-it-to'em!!

Bernard Prophesy on Ron Paul:

Now if you have talked to me since the first of the year for any amount of time, I probably told you what has become known as the "Bernard Prophesy." So here it is so I can say, "I told you so!":) For seven months I have "prophesied" that Ron Paul would be our next President. I have not said that because I want Ron to be president, which I do, but simply by reading bits of the campaign as I have. Long before McCain's health or his age came into play, I said that McCain would have a "medical problem" just before the Republican National Convention and throw the whole event into an uproar. Why do you think Ron Paul is staging such a big event in Saint Paul? To draw his supporters there… I predict that dark horse candidate Ron Paul will be nominated and win. And while it remains to be known if this "prophesy" will come to pass, I have withdrawn my not-so-secret campaign to be Ron Paul's Secretary of T reasury. This is not because I would not follow Ron to Hell if he was President or because I am not qualified, I am just not qualified in the asskissing department and was totally offended by Jesse Benton, Ron's very rude communication director and his best friend Lew Rockwell who has stabbed Liberty Dollar in the back since Day One. Thanks but no thanks. Good luck, Ron.

New Ron Paul Video: Duncan McPherson the RCO in Boston has created a HOT entertaining video about Ron Paul and the Liberty Dollar. View it at:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsqLpwHt6I8

e-Gold Pleads Guilty to Money Laundering

I regret to report that my friend and the first digital gold activist now face years and fines when he is sentenced on November 20. Please click HERE to read the article.

Two belated Articles about the Motion filed in Idaho:

PLEASE NOTE: This motion has been withdrawn as the governments motion was filed first and took precedent. The first article by Joe Goldstein with the New York Sun is a great article regarding the First Motion filed by the twelve certificate holders in Coeur d'Alene, Idaho.

1. "Government Is Sued Over Seizure of Liberty Dollars"

A dozen people around the country filed suit in U.S. District Court in Idaho this week demanding the return of all the copper, silver, gold, and platinum coins - more than seven tons of metal in all - that the FBI and Secret Service seized in November during raids of a mint in Idaho… Please click HERE for the complete article.

Here is another great article by Anne Allen published by the Idaho Statesman:

2. "Suit filed in Idaho over Liberty coins"

Twelve people who said they bought the coins being touted as an alternative to legal tender have sued the government in a federal court in Idaho to get their coins back.

Federal agents seized the gold and silver coins from the Sunshine Mint warehouse in Coeur d'Alene. Please click HERE for the complete article.

My retirement is on track for October 1, 2008. Of course, I will still be on the hook for all the legal issues surrounding the Liberty Dollar, which I see as the golden opportunity to vindicate the Liberty Dollar as a legal currency.

Please don't ask, "Why did the Liberty Dollar close?" PLEASE TAKE ACTION. You only get to keep what you are willing to fight for. If you are not taking part you will lose your property. So I hope you will continue to support the Liberty Dollar - with an order and a donation.

Please check out the new Shopping Cart available HERE.

And remember to stick-it-to'em with a new Ron Paul Nickel!

My sincere thanks for all your efforts to return America to value - one Liberty Dollar at a time! I hope to hear from you soon!

Bernard von NotHaus
Monetary Architect/Editor
http://www.LibertyDollar.org
888.LIB.DOLLAR
888.421.6181
________________________________________

[Evil Squirrel Overlord]

Please send as many checks as possible and make them all payable to "Liberty Dollar." Thanks.

Where is TUC when you need them?

[Judge Roy Bean]

I'd try reading it again but I fear two things: It wouldn't make any more sense than after the first go 'round and two, there could be damage to cognitive areas of Ol' Bean's brain.

What the Hell did he say?

[notorial dissent]

Ole von Nuthouse getting a bit strident and desperate sounding don’t you think? Not enough customers/suckers to keep the con bankrolled, how tragic!!!! And sure they are going to rush right out and send donations to an already dead issue, even his customers aren’t quite that dumb, are they?

[Evil Squirrel Overlord]

http://www.libertydollar.org/order_form ... tha_of.pdf

Payment must be either money orders or checks made out to "Bernard”. If any other name is used your Funds will have to be returned. Your order will not be fulfilled.

Yep, times are tough.

Further down the form:

Mail completed order form, your Liberty Dollar (if applicable) and payment made out to “Liberty Numismatics” to…

Looks like Bernard needs an editor.

[grixit]

An amazing combination of arrogance and mendacity.

[Dr. Caligari]

Where is TUC when you need them?

What ever happened to TUC? And where did the thread about them go?

[webhick]

Alert #21: August 5th. 2008

Not a Wednesday. But I'm tired and sick, and I don't really care.

Dear Liberty Dollar Supporters,

Given what follows, shouldn't that be "Dear Liberty Dollar Supporter"?

There seems to be some confusion regarding the company name, which is understandable since the name and business entity has changed several times. The company is now incorporated in Nevada as "Liberty Dollar Inc."

Yes, and I couldn't help but notice that you're not listed as an officer. Just Rachelle. That is just the cutest little attempt to throw her under the bus. It won't work. Everyone knows who's calling the shots over there, regardless of who is listed on the incorporation paperwork.

Please send as many checks as possible and make them all payable to "Liberty Dollar."

I think it'd be funny if everyone did just that, but instead of sending decent size "donations", they sent him lots of $0.01 checks. Being a corporate account, he can't cash them and take it home, so he'll have to deposit them and since most corporate accounts have a limit on how many items you can deposit per month before they start feeing you "per item", he'll quickly start losing money on those transactions.

I'm not saying anyone should do it, just that it gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling when I think about it.

But you may not have much of an opportunity… as I regret to inform you that the Liberty Dollar may close.

So, you're saying that everyone jump on the opportunity to send checks now because you won't be around much longer? Sure, let me just cut that check for $300 so you can up and close shop next week.

This is not hype or threat. It's simply hard reality. It's sad.

I'm not sad. I bet you're sad though, what with the impending charges and the lack of available suckers. Everyone knows your name now, and I doubt they'll be buying into your next scheme.

Yes, I know it's the Summer Slows and Summer Lows for the metals market. Yes, I know the silver will be HOT in three ! months.

Does that mean that those $20 Liberty Dollars are now worth a whole lot less than $20?

Yes, I know you still "support" the Liberty Dollar.

No, not really.

But just ask yourself, "What have you ordered from the Liberty Dollar in the last month?"

I'm sure that many who placed orders right before you got raided are still ordering you to give their money back.

Unfortunately, I know the answer… for the vast majority… it is "none." I know that because we have received very very few orders in the last 30 days. No donations. And only three $100 contributions to the Contingency Club.

It took everyone a while, but they finally caught on.

Sorry, but that just isn't enough to stay in business.

Oooh, how catty! It's the customer's fault that you made promises you couldn't keep!

Yes, the initial response after the raid, eight months ago, was tremendous and you put the Liberty Dollar back in business. Thank you! But the last three months have been terrible.

This is what happens when you bleed your supporters dry in the first few months and then have nothing to show for it.

Even with free rent and reduced rates from our attorney, zero income doesn't cover the phone bill, etc.

I like how this implies that zero income covers the reduced rates from the attorney. Math like that inspires the utmost confidence in your scam.

We lose without your support.

News flash: You lose with their support, too.

Maybe the problem has been that you can't order online.

That's lovely. Chastise them for not supporting you and then confess that you were unable to accept their support.

Now, if all 4,000 people simply sent $10… that would be $40,000…

Ah, but all those 4,000 people already sent you money. And they have nothing to show for it.

Please Click HERE to donate $10 or more for the deadbeats in the group and be a part of the solution.

Probably not a good idea to call your customers deadbeats publicly like that. Especially since they already sent you money, didn't receive the product, and probably sent you more money after the raid for the legal fund. I think that makes them suckers and not deadbeats.

Regardless of the time or cost… the Liberty Dollar is going to WIN!!!

Yeah, cause it's your money. Oh, and if you don't send enough and LD goes out of business, then von NotHaus walks away with your cash... AND THAT'S A WIN! For him, not you, of course.

New Ron Paul Nickel - Sticks it to'em!

Like Teflon.

Nick has a very inexpensive sticker with the Ron Paul Liberty design that just fits on a nickel! Stick it on and stick it to those F!@#$#@S! who confiscated your Liberty Dollars! Let the nickel rage. Plus the "nickel" sticker is extremely well done… even the micro denticle lettering around the border is readable. Prices very on quantity including postage: Minimum of 10 for $4, 100 for $10, 500 for $45 and 1000 stickers for $80. Get stickers on our new Shopping Cart. And stick-it-to'em!!

Wow, so the "Ron Paul Nickel" is just a sticker? That costs $0.08 - $0.40 each? I've never been so elated! Now I can convert my existing worthless $0.50 coins into worthless $0.50 coins - all for an additional $0.08!

Head hurts. Skipped the rest of the garbage.

[iplawyer]

I think somebody should encourage those 4000 people to send him a $20 liberty dollar. He says they are better than FRNs - right?

[LPC]

Even with free rent and reduced rates from our attorney, zero income doesn't cover the phone bill, etc.

So the lawyer and the telephone company aren't taking the Liberty Dollars?

That's shocking.

[fortinbras]

One of the major drawbacks to Liberty Dollar "Bernie Bucks" (from its founder, Bernard von NotHaus, who called himself an economist ... although no one else did, but actually made a livelihood stamping out and selling souvenir buttons and medallions) is that you always paid a great deal more than the market price for what you were purportedly getting. Yes, his original "Silver Liberty" was - I am willing to believe - one ounce of pure silver, and originally you'd pay Von NotHaus $10 for it - when the market price on an ounce of pure silver was around $6, and the US Mint was selling a govt-approved Silver Eagle - also one ounce pure silver - for about $7.50 (and you could get a Canadian Silver Mapleleaf coin, ditto, for about the same price). Now, or at least before the FBI raid, the price of Bernie Bucks had gazumped up, ahead of the market price for silver, to $20 for the one ounce Liberty.

Now the crucial difference between the Silver Eagle (or the Silver Mapleleaf) and the Silver Liberty is this: The Eagle, being a product of the US govt mint, was protected by law from counterfeiting or any other hankypanky (and the Canadian Mapleleaf similarly, even under US law), so when you took the Silver Eagle to a coin shop or bank or some other potential buyer, he was confident that it weighed one ounce and really was pure silver, and you'd get the going rate at least. No such assurance for the Liberty; you'd have to talk long and hard to persuade a buyer to take it, and, since he probably still had his doubts about it, you'd probably get a deeply discounted payment for the Liberty.

Originally, von NotHaus's outfit (then named NORFED) would send you for your $10 in real money their own paper money, showing the Statue of Liberty. Although they told you to treat this as money it was actually captioned, and legally designated, a "warehouse receipt". It was a chit for the Liberty "coin" supposedly waiting for you in NORFED's vault. The paper "warehouse receipt" carried a notice that it was good for only 20 years from its issue date -- meaning that the acceptability of the paper as a money substitute decreases with time because takers will be increasing concerned by the approaching deadline. You could trade in the paper for the silver coin but you'd have to pay von NotHaus some additional money for shipping, handling and insurance. I had a gut feeling that these extra charges would raise the final cost of the Liberty to fully twice the market rate for silver.

However, some people were quite willing to accept the paper. NORFED was operating as, among other things, a "warehouse bank" - a sort of domestic offshore stash. People could send NORFED their real money, get the NORFED paper as a receipt, and be confident that their stashed money would be (since NORFED did not report these things to the IRS) invisible to tax collectors, ex-wives, and other creditors. The expense involved in getting a refund in real money from NORFED could easily be borne as the price of hiding assets from creditors. The National Barter Assn had once run a similar warehouse bank; when its manager died, leaving no useful records (it was his selling point that he guaranteed there'd be no paperwork kept for the IRS to find) and having kept the deposits in a bank deposit box in his own name, virtually all the depositors were screwed.

I would suppose that, now, all those people holding von NotHaus's paper have discovered that have pretty worthless paper. It's pretty but it's now worthless. Those lucky enough to have the actual coins will soon discover that, as von NotHaus's scheme fades from memory, it will be tougher and tougher to persuade other people to accept the coins as anything near the value claimed for them.

[webhick]

I'll just take the X-5 and let the trailer park crowd worry about the dollar.

Don't throw your money away, get a Koenigsegg CCX



Just make sure they put a spoiler on the back. Otherwise, the ass-end lifts off the track and it starts eating tire walls. Looking at that car makes me feel like I've been driving on the rumble strips.

Anyway, it's a real steal at 200,000 FRN.

[The Operative]

Don't throw your money away, get a Koenigsegg CCX



Just make sure they put a spoiler on the back. Otherwise, the ass-end lifts off the track and it starts eating tire walls. Looking at that car makes me feel like I've been driving on the rumble strips.

Anyway, it's a real steal at 200,000 FRN.

If you want a real car, get the SSC Ultimate Aero. 0-60 in 2.8 seconds, top speed over 255mph, over 1100bhp, only $650,000.

[webhick]

If you want a real car, get the SSC Ultimate Aero. 0-60 in 2.8 seconds, top speed over 255mph, over 1100bhp, only $650,000.

I refuse to drool over a car whose front end is reminiscent of a vacuum cleaner that's had an anvil dropped on it and the back end looks like the grill at the bottom my refrigerator.

Seriously, why should the Illuminati spend $650k on a company car that looks like a mess of household appliances when it can spend $200k and make me happy?

[DarkestBeforeDawn]

And for the record, if there was a complete breakdown of society, this will be the most important "precious metals" asset you can own:

You can have all the gold and silver you want, but if you only have gold and silver and all I have is a semi-automatic rifle with copper jacketed rounds.........well, you can figure out the rest.

The ultimate asset is food and energy --- just go watch The Road Warrior, without protection neither means anything.

With that said I get a kick out of the whole anti-TP movement. I mean you are talking about such little money -- you should see what the corporations are doing. Virtually none of them go to jail -- you can kick profits offshore with derivatives, you can lie to investors, you can basically commit fraud and tax evasion in the tune of 100s of billions if not trillions over years and all they have to do is pay a small fine once they are caught on something. Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac said they were fine a month ago. This country is one big hoot -- it's like watch the comedy channel.

Not only do the big guys get away with just about everything in the book -- they get the taxpayers to bail out the companies as well. Welcome to I.O.U.S.A.

Mean the whole Liberty Dollar thing, why on gods earth wouldn't you just go buy some freaking silver and gold coins, instead of just more paper if you don't plan on trading it. Strange world.

[webhick]

Before you buy those hideously expensive and uber-powerful cars, check out this site first:

The Illuminati do not get into car accidents. We cause them. Where have you been?

[Joey Smith]

why on gods earth wouldn't you just go buy some freaking silver and gold coins

Because, like any other commodity, it can down down as quickly as it can go up. I've got a buddy who was lured into investing in oil futures, and pretty much got wiped out by the recent price drop. Now of course he wants to sue his broker who got him into the deal (as if he didn't understand the market risk).

If it makes you feel better, invest in all the gold and silver you want. Me, I still prefer real estate (the one item which really is a limited commodity, especially on the coasts) and the existing bust makes investing in property suddenly attractive, and then things that I can consume and enjoy.

[notorial dissent]

The other problem with the “we’ll be alright we have gold crowd”, is how are you going to cash/spend it, and more importantly hang on to it long enough to spend it.

The big problem with gold has always been, that someone always wants it.

[DarkestBeforeDawn]

Because, like any other commodity, it can down down as quickly as it can go up. I've got a buddy who was lured into investing in oil futures, and pretty much got wiped out by the recent price drop. Now of course he wants to sue his broker who got him into the deal (as if he didn't understand the market risk).

If it makes you feel better, invest in all the gold and silver you want. Me, I still prefer real estate (the one item which really is a limited commodity, especially on the coasts) and the existing bust makes investing in property suddenly attractive, and then things that I can consume and enjoy.

Everything goes in cycles, even gold & silver. Anybody that tells you otherwise has not a clue. Paper products have always gone from creation to highly priced back to zero, always. That does not mean gold and silver or oil or food will not go up and down in value. Ultimately, paper products go to zero -- gold is the ultimate currency when faith is lost in paper currencies, which like I said always happens.

Real estate is somewhat in that category but not within the present real estate bubble -- but yes when paper products fall I would rather some land than some paper people might end up using as a fire source.

If you are trading, yes, of course there is no guarantee -- he actually not even trading a commodity, he is trading a paper product with a commodity product name on it.

- Paper products always go to zero, the only question is when
- Gold and silver trade more as a commodity when there is faith in paper products
- Gold and silver trade more like a currency because they are the ultimate currency when faith in paper product declines
- If you trade in commodities you of course can lose or gain value including g&s
- There is no investment with reward which does not have risk associate with it
- Every compounded interest based system has collapsed, it's pure math -- it has too, the only question is when... a gold standard can help in the collapse but either way if you are based on compounding interest even a gold standard system will collapse, but the collapse will be less painful.

100% faith in paper is a horrible idea, but that is what this country has gone to -- the result will not be pretty. Nothing I can do about it, maybe the next generation will learn but I am to the point where I think humans will always disregard history and math when greed becomes the easier road to take.

[DarkestBeforeDawn]

The other problem with the “we’ll be alright we have gold crowd”, is how are you going to cash/spend it, and more importantly hang on to it long enough to spend it.

The big problem with gold has always been, that someone always wants it.

There is no problem with gold being the money standard. The problem is no asset standard for your currency, hence they have replaced the money with a paper substitute. So, what you have is paper products that are on top of the paper money substitute.

In reality you can use anything you want as long as it's somewhat control in quantity usually by nature. Some people in the South Pacific used a specific rare rock, whatever you use for the standard is beside the point. It's the limiting of the amount of the item. Gold has been widely used since the first of human history and to some extent silver, platinum, and other metals.

It (gold & silver standard) doesn't solve economic problems, all it does is help contain problems which would occur if based on a human paper or electronic money substitute. Man has been trying to destroy gold for generations -- why? Well, it would be a lot easier to live if you can control the money supply yourself. It really comes down to greed, whether by bankers, investors, politicians, or even the average joe.

There are advantages to paper money substitute -- higher growth can be realized because it extends credit creation but there is a huge downside to that as well. When the credit creation paper products go to zero they bring your backbone of your economy down with it. See Weimar Republic, see even the Zimbabwean dollar situation occurring at this moment.

The dirty little secret that even gold supporters even do not consider is the eventual collapse of the compounding interest equation of the economy. Any system that is based on compounding interest will at some point collapse, it doesn't matter if you have a paper currency or a gold coin currency.

- Gold & Silver will not stop economic collapses
- Gold & Silver can extremely help in limiting the amount of damage caused by those collapses
- All paper financial instruments eventually go to zero value, the only question being when?
- Gold & Silver standard are bankers worse nightmare because it limits money creation -- bankers would rather make money from doing nothing
- A paper money substitute always works, until the day it does, then it goes to zero value or near zero value
- The final result of using the compounding interest equation in the economy can be very fruitful until the end result happens, which is a final implosion - it doesn't matter if it's a paper based economy or gold based economy. You shouldn't complain when the final implosion happens when you have been enjoying the advantages to this type of system for so long, the consequences may make you rethink what has been going on. That is if you get the time to rethink it.