Liberty Dollar, Part 4

[Demosthenes]

Dear Liberty Supporter;
The recent alert had an incorrect description of the the new $20 Base Starter Kit and Liberty Dollar Supporter Kits The alert text could be read thatwe are selling 5 oz of Silver Libertys $100 face value for $20. Obviously we can't and are not doing that.
Additionally, to clarify the remaining $50 Base Libertys are available at the rates in the alert are for Associates. All others still pay face value
We apologize for any confusion this may have caused.
The Libery Dollar Team

[Number Six]

Hard assets, yes, Libbies, no. It was a valiant enterprise in conception, but like "E-Gold" became a magnet for shady operators.

[notorial dissent]

Yes, but by all means, do spend $50 for $8 worth of silver and make numnutz there rich, obviously in the new math $8 worth of silver for $50 is valid.

And with regard to the “NFV” nonsense, surely they have heard of the “difference that is no difference, is no difference” rule. No, probably not.

[Trippy]

#3: RCO and Liberty Associate Model
Over the last 10 years Liberty Dollar Associate Program has morphed and changed in price and form. Ultimately it is best to have a simple program so as many people as possible get Silver Libertys and use them as a private voluntary barter currency. All current Liberty Associates are still Associates. All fees for new Associates are suspended indefinitely. Our main goal is to get as much silver in people's hands to provide an alternative currency in the trying times ahead that are sure to bring much inflation and even hyper inflation. Tell your friends to sign up now to benefit as an associate.

Sounds like Mr. Priest is getting a bit shrill ... and desperate ... Perhaps he's realizing the "boring" job at Microsoft wasn't so bad after all.

[.]

All fees for new Associates are suspended indefinitely

We're so full of it that even the average Paytriot has figured us out.

Holding your breath until we get a merchant account will probably be terminal.

[fortinbras]

A similar new privately issued currency scheme - in Japan - has ended with arrests and indictments:
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?tit ... ntable=yes

[Demosthenes]

Liberty Dollar News
January 2009

Click HERE to Read Online.
Table of Contents:
1. Wild West stagecoach run from Sunshine to our new mint
2. The New 2009 Silver Liberty is available Now
3. Success story - Gold fever in Pismo Beach
4. 2009 $1 Peace Dollar ships. LNE and FDI Sells out!
5. Gideon Gono, head of Zimbabwe Central Bank to advise the Obama Administration
6. Liberty Dollar detailed in the River City Reader

1. From the CEO's Desk - A crazy wild west stagecoach run with 25,000 oz of silver from the Idaho panhandle to Southern California
Have I got a story to tell you! Bernard and I are working on a project to allow Liberty Dollar to operate with minimal supply delays that are plaguing the Silver dealers. Our goal is to be able to ship within three days after payment is received. As part of this project, we worked with a number of Liberty Dollar supporters to create an inventory to more quickly replenish the Silver Libertys you order. January started out with a top secret run from Sunshine Mint in the Idaho panhandle all the way to Southern California. I bribed my dad with a 1 oz gold liberty to do a road trip with me the week after the new year. So like a trouper he showed up in Sacramento with his one-ton pickup and we drove to Portland on Day One and then on to Coeur d'Alene, Idaho for an early morning pickup of 25,000 ounces of silver at the Sunshine Mint.

It was snowing and cold. See my picture next to the truck in the snow. The blue tarp on the back is covering twenty-five 1,000 ounce bars of silver. By the way, 25,000 ounces is almost 1800 lbs. 25 thousand ounce bars of silver really aren't that big but the truck definitely settled when the forklift sat the pallet on the truck bed. We then began the straight-through trek from Coeur d'Alene to southern California -- a journey of 1400+ miles and over 20 hours. The first hour was white knuckle tense as we looked over our shoulders and checked the rearview mirrors, regularly wondering if the word somehow got out about our silver run. But after an hour we realized that no one was following us and settled in to a long trip south, running ahead of a snowstorm until Portland, Oregon. Twenty four hours later we delivered the silver to the new mint with a sigh of relief.

2. Order the New 2009 Silver Liberty Now
The 2009 $20 one ounce Silver Liberty continues to improve its design to eliminate any possible confusion with the addition of: PVBC acronym for "private voluntary barter currency" and MSRP acronym for "Manufacturers Suggested Retail Price" to define the face value. "Inflation Proof Silver" and NFV for "Nominal Face Value" have also been added to the reverse. Click HERE to Pre Order and Get Yours First. Limit 10.

3. Success story - Gold Fever in Pismo Beach
Anne, a friend of mine and a recent convert to Liberty Dollar received a quarter ounce $500 Gold Liberty in exchange for her consulting services in Pismo Beach, California. She had wanted to keep the Liberty but as the month drew to a close she needed to pay her office rent. She began a quest to exchange her Gold Liberty and had conversations with the local coin shop (he was clueless). She then called an Associate she knew and he offered her $400. Then she showed it to the building manager who agreed to show it to the landlord. Well, once the building manager had the Liberty he didn't want to release it and bought it from Anne for $475. She had so much fun and met so many new people that she is convinced that bartering with Liberty Dollars are absolutely the way to go. Who knows? We may have the seeds of a community currency planted in Pismo Beach!

4. 2009 $1 Peace Dollar ships
The Peace Dollars have arrived and we have shipped over 15,000 of the 30,000. They are already selling on eBay for $8.00. The Limited Numbered and First Day of Issue with the hand punched hallmark are SOLD OUT! Luck you if you got some of these at the unbelievable introductory prices. As soon as we can get some, we will make them available at secondary market prices. Once we have shipped all the General Issues out the door we will offer a new copper Liberty Dollar issue. Stay tuned for that announcement.

5. Gideon Gono, Head of the Zimbabwean Central Bank to Advise the Obama Administration
You may have heard that Zimbabwe recently knocked 12 zeroes off their currency. A trillion dollar note? Click HERE for a great spoof about Gono the king of hyperinflation in Zimbabwe advising the Obama administration: Well, maybe it's not a spoof. Could hyperinflation be just around the corner for the USA?

6. The Future of Money?
River City Reader article details Liberty Dollar…
In the Chambersburg, Pennsylvania, area, you can walk around with coins in your pocket that can be exchanged for goods and services at more than five dozen merchants. They say "Liberty" and "Trust in God" on the front, and on the back they claim a value of $20 or $50. They're made of silver, and they are neither produced nor endorsed by the federal government. In Fairfield, Iowa, those same coins are accepted at more than 15 merchants…Read this article here at http://www.rcreader.com.
The big news is that the Liberty Dollar continues to move forward due to your support. That's all for now. Stay tuned for more news in upcoming issues of the newsletter.
Dan Priest CEO
________________________________________

[webhick]

1. From the CEO's Desk - A crazy wild west stagecoach run with 25,000 oz of silver from the Idaho panhandle to Southern California

What next? In-juns?

January started out with a top secret run from Sunshine Mint in the Idaho panhandle all the way to Southern California.

So...I guess it's declassified now. It's not like you'll ever be doing another run like that again...

I bribed my dad with a 1 oz gold liberty to do a road trip with me the week after the new year.

I looked. I couldn't find one of those for sale. I did find a 1/4 oz gold liberty, which retails for $500. I think that means that you "bribed" your dad with $2000.

The blue tarp on the back is covering twenty-five 1,000 ounce bars of silver. By the way, 25,000 ounces is almost 1800 lbs.
...snip...
We then began the straight-through trek from Coeur d'Alene to southern California -- a journey of 1400+ miles and over 20 hours.

WAIT. You drove around with 3/4 ton of silver bars in the back of a pickup with nothing but a tarp covering it? Do you know what happens to the cargo in tarped pickups at red lights? And you could shell out $2k for daddy's help, but were too cheap to rent something a little more secure than a tarped pickup? Yep. You worked for Microsoft.

3. Success story - Gold Fever in Pismo Beach
Anne, a friend of mine and a recent convert to Liberty Dollar received a quarter ounce $500 Gold Liberty in exchange for her consulting services in Pismo Beach, California. She had wanted to keep the Liberty but as the month drew to a close she needed to pay her office rent. She began a quest to exchange her Gold Liberty and had conversations with the local coin shop (he was clueless). She then called an Associate she knew and he offered her $400. Then she showed it to the building manager who agreed to show it to the landlord. Well, once the building manager had the Liberty he didn't want to release it and bought it from Anne for $475.

HA! Her client just screwed her out of $25 and the billable hours she lost while trying to exchange it to USD. SUCCESS!!

[The Operative]

3. Success story - Gold Fever in Pismo Beach
Anne, a friend of mine and a recent convert to Liberty Dollar received a quarter ounce $500 Gold Liberty in exchange for her consulting services in Pismo Beach, California. She had wanted to keep the Liberty but as the month drew to a close she needed to pay her office rent. She began a quest to exchange her Gold Liberty and had conversations with the local coin shop (he was clueless). She then called an Associate she knew and he offered her $400. Then she showed it to the building manager who agreed to show it to the landlord. Well, once the building manager had the Liberty he didn't want to release it and bought it from Anne for $475.

HA! Her client just screwed her out of $25 and the billable hours she lost while trying to exchange it to USD. SUCCESS!!

Yup, didn't you know that is how it is supposed to work? Everyone who accepts a liberty coin gets screwed until it finally is accepted by someone at current value of the metal. She is lucky she only got screwed out of $25. The coin dealer probably wasn't clueless, he probably wasn't going to touch a 'gold' coin that wasn't from one of the few big mints where coins are guaranteed to contain a certain precious metal content. At least he wasn't going to buy it at the current spot price for gold or even at a small discount. He probably told her that he would give her $150, maybe $175 for it.

[notorial dissent]

Let’s see, was paid for $500 worth of work, with a $500 libby 1/4 oz gold round, that at spot is worth maybe $230, so she got cheated out of $250 to start with, then she traded it to someone who didn’t know what it was worth, who won’t be able to get his money back, will eventually figure out he has been taken, and come after her, and that doesn’t count the possibility of her being turned in to the Treasury for passing counterfeit money, which she technically was. So all in all, she is not only out the work she did initially, but will most likely be out a whole lot more when it comes back to haunt her later. Yep, real wonderful mode of exchange.

[fortinbras]

Somehow being paid for $500 worth of work with a drachma that nobody else - even Associates in the LD scam - values at $500, so that I can only cash it in at a significant loss, doesn't seem like a success story to me.

[grixit]

I'd like to hear her side of the story.

[Number Six]

I asked a salesman for "Liberty dollars" a couple of questions about selling libbies and precious metals. No good answer, but another fellow spoke up and said he usually goes to a gun show to sell gold. Why trade cash for silver or gold if you lose money when you go to exchange back to cash? Most coin dealers ask for i.d. on transactions, the bigger dealers generally have a "Patriot Act" compliance plan to report suspicious transactions...i.e. swarthy-complexioned men with strange accents, or drug dealers who are trying to launder drug money.

The better coin dealers have $30-$40 dollar spreads on gold ounces, so you break even if the metal rises by that amount. But if someone is not filing taxes, he isn't going to want to leave a paper trail with the coin dealer. Not as if the IRS is going to be interested in tracking penny-ante tax cheats, but the fear of later penalties is likely.

[notorial dissent]

It still comes back to the difference between a legal tender coin that has a legal value and a provenance, and a slug that is mismarked as to value with no verified content, and for which the owner undoubtedly paid twice the actual value of the gold with no provenance and no guarantee of value or purity. Sounds like a real sure fire bargain to me.

No wonder coin dealers and independents are unwilling to take the chance on getting screwed on an unknown quantity. Most of the coin dealers and PM people I have talked with wouldn’t do more than a quarter to maybe half on the possible metal value, and most said they wouldn’t touch them.

[grixit]

When Liberty Dollars were displayed
The dealer folk would laugh
They'd laugh
When Liberty Dollars were assayed
Their worth was less than half
Cause the value declared came from somewhere inside
The bottom of Von Nothaus
When it came to treating dumb investors
He was just a louse!

[mutter]

let me see if i understand whats going on here.
People who dont want to use FRNs are minting their own gold and silver coins
WHICH YOU BUY WITH FRN's???????????????
then YOU have to pass them off to someone, who has to then sell the gold content or the coin(same thing) for FRN's
I can here bugs bunny saying "What a bunch of maroons"

[Burzmali]

Given that most of the Liberty Mint's vendors are precious metals savvy, I wonder how many accept Libbies as payment, at anything higher than the value of the base metal.

[notorial dissent]

.....I can here bugs bunny saying "What a bunch of maroons"

Got it in one Mutter. The only ones coming out ahead in this scam are the mint/Libby makers, and maybe the dealers, although there I would bet not so much or if at all. Amazingly none of the supporters have seemed to twig to this simple fact, even the ones who have been jailed for passing counterfeit money seem to get it, they're just being persecuted you know. I think it goes back to the old maxim that you mention "gold" and some people's rational thought processes shut down.

Given that most of the Liberty Mint's vendors are precious metals savvy, I wonder how many accept Libbies as payment, at anything higher than the value of the base metal.

Burzmali, I would have to take exception to your remark here. I find it inconceivable that the dealers could be “precious metals savvy” as you put it and actually buying those things, unless, their intention was to defraud their customers. They are not worth their implied face value, there is no guarantee of their actual value, and there is next to no market for them, excepting to the clueless and bewildered, which again, constitutes intent to defraud.

[Number Six]

Of course the coins and the paper are now worth whatever they melt for. There are numerous "rounds" of silver of various descriptions that are generally traded at melt. The "fraud" and "conspiracy" come into play when what is claimed and what is actual value are quite different. There must have been a lot of complaints about the operation before they were raided.

I once bought a "1903 $20 liberty" that was a counterfeit. I showed it to a dealer who assayed it around the expected .967 ounce gold, but said a lot of these copies came out of Saudi countries in the early 1970's as alternatives to kruggerands, when there was no other country minting modern gold rounds.

[Burzmali]

Given that most of the Liberty Mint's vendors are precious metals savvy, I wonder how many accept Libbies as payment, at anything higher than the value of the base metal.

Burzmali, I would have to take exception to your remark here. I find it inconceivable that the dealers could be “precious metals savvy” as you put it and actually buying those things, unless, their intention was to defraud their customers. They are not worth their implied face value, there is no guarantee of their actual value, and there is next to no market for them, excepting to the clueless and bewildered, which again, constitutes intent to defraud.

Well, some vendors could buy into the whole "alternate currency" mythology. It seems likely to me that some would exist among the precious metal and mints of the world, and FunHouse is likely the kind of person who would seek to business with those who share his ideals...