Brown supporter trial (Continued)

[Demosthenes]

Welcome to Quatloos, TheWatcher!

[TheWatcher (MIA)]

Thanks.

I stumbled across this place a few weeks ago and I have been reading everything I can since then. There is quite a bit of useful info here. My only fear is that my head will swell with all the knowledge and I will soon become top heavy.

[RyanMcC]

My only fear is that my head will swell with all the knowledge and I will soon become top heavy.

Be careful, it actually has the opposite effect.

Me before Quatloos*:


Me after Quatloos*:


* neither of those people are actually me.

[wserra]

The lower one is the last guy who didn't take the plea.

[wserra]

Sorry to be tedious about this

What else do lawyers do?

Dan, you're certainly right that on their facts neither Johnson nor Phelin control the situation which you discuss - a witness claiming the privilege in front of the jury. I quoted what I did because (1) it is from SCOTUS, (2) lower courts quote the same language in upholding trial rulings that won't let non-party witnesses do so, and (3) the language itself is broad enough to cover our situation. Such a lower court decision (among many others) is United States v. Deutsch, 987 F.2d 878 (2d Cir. 1993): "Although neither party may properly draw such inferences [from a claim of Fifth A. privilege], it is feared that its assertion in the presence of the jury may have a disproportionate effect on its deliberations." As in Deutsch, typically a trial court will hold a brief hearing out the the jury's presence to determine whether the witness has any relevant, non-privileged testimony; if the answer is "no", the witness never appears in front of the jury.

When I was doing criminal work, it happened to me more than once.

[Imalawman]

Why was this an issue? Did Scoop not want to testify?

I had the same reaction, but I think us lawyers are the only ones who would think that testifying is fun. hell, I'd be totally bummed if I didn't get to testify after I was slated to do so.

Those of us in the reporting business don't much care to be in the testifying business. Not to mention the fact that I knew nothing of any consequence to Riley's defense.

I don't blame you one bit for being relieved. It can be a real pain in the ass for sure. I've always kind of enjoyed it, but then again, I enjoy tax law...so my judgment is very questionable.

[Dezcad]

As I said before, I think that a jury should NOT be allowed to draw inferences from a 5th Amendment claim by a non-defendant witness, but because of the 6th Amendment and not the 5th. If a 5th Amendment claim by a witness could be considered by a jury, then a jury would be able to consider the "testimony" of a witness (i.e., the assertion that the testimony might incriminate the witness) without the defendant being able to cross-examine and "confront" the witness, as guaranteed by the 6th Amendment.

While I agree that a jury should NOT be allowed to draw inferences, in practice, it is difficult to accomplish. No curative instruction will "unring the bell" and there is the danger that the jury would draw some inference - conciously or subconciously.

In that regard, I can understand why this should be done outside the presence of the jury so as to avoid any potential risk, IMHO.

[Judge Roy Bean]

Having once testified as a "witness" in a case, it is a painful experience. Being a lawyer by training and a witness by accident is a conflicting. It is very difficult to separate the "witness" role from the "advocate" role.

Particularly in the same case. I remember seeing senior counsel in a case take the stand for his party as an expert witness on legal fees and then try to respond for/over his rookie co-counsel when objections and argument ensued. The judge had to warn him more than once and it was priceless just to watch him try to refrain from making pained or approving expressions while the Judge watched him like a hawk.

[ErsatzAnatchist]

Having once testified as a "witness" in a case, it is a painful experience. Being a lawyer by training and a witness by accident is a conflicting. It is very difficult to separate the "witness" role from the "advocate" role.

Particularly in the same case. I remember seeing senior counsel in a case take the stand for his party as an expert witness on legal fees and then try to respond for/over his rookie co-counsel when objections and argument ensued. The judge had to warn him more than once and it was priceless just to watch him try to refrain from making pained or approving expressions while the Judge watched him like a hawk.

I had represented one of the parties in bankruptcy litigation and was called as a witness in a post-divorce hearing on some financial matters. My former client's family law attorney was an IDIOT and I saw my former client's family law case go done the drain. :@#$: It was painful.

[Demosthenes]

Short version.

Jose Gonzalez took the 5th.

Romeo Gonzalez took the 5th.

Reno Gonzalez took the stand.

Today was ...

[Imalawman]

Short version.

Jose Gonzalez took the 5th.

Romeo Gonzalez took the 5th.

Reno Gonzalez took the stand.

Today was ...

So...Jose was looking forward to defending his son...by taking the 5th?!?!? All that sound and fury signifying nothing.

[Dezcad]

Today was ...

We're all waiting.......

[Demosthenes]

Those of you who are local should consider making the trip to the courthouse tomorrow morning...

[Demosthenes]

Jose not testifying is the little story.

Reno testifying is the big story.

[Cobalt Shiva]

Jose not testifying is the little story.

Reno testifying is the big story.

Sounds like this is going to be fun on a stick!

[webhick]

Those of you who are local should consider making the trip to the courthouse tomorrow morning...

I wanted to show up today to watch everyone take the 5th, but there's this pesky thing that kept getting in the way...what was it again?

Oh yeah, work.

[Demosthenes]

Reno's cross examination starts at 8:30 am for those who can make it.

[Cobalt Shiva]

Those of you who are local should consider making the trip to the courthouse tomorrow morning...

I wanted to show up today to watch everyone take the 5th, but there's this pesky thing that kept getting in the way...what was it again?

Oh yeah, work.

Work is a four-letter word.

(Count 'em yourself if you don't believe me.)

[ErsatzAnatchist]

Reno's cross examination starts at 8:30 am for those who can make it.

:@#$: :@#$: :@#$: :@#$: :@#$: :@#$: :@#$: :@#$:

I have Court in Manchester at 9:00 and 10:30. I will see if I can get out of my 10:30 hearings and get back to Concord, ASAP.

[Gregg]

***trying to figure out how a long a drive it is from Columbus Ohio***

**figure I CAN get away with playing hookey for a day**

*deciding whether it's worth the effort to see what Scoop really looks like*

you see, I had no interest in Scoop's appearence until y'all brought it up, but a full blown tax looney under cross AND the mystery solved, well, I bought a brand new car on Monday and it may need a road trip to break it in...